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[Music]

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foreign

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[Applause]

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foreign

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[Music]

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foreign

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yes hello from the high peaks Wilderness

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I bid you all good evening good morning

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good afternoon wherever you may be

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Across the Nation around the world my

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name is Leah Prime and this is the

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invisible night school

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for those of you just joining us the

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invisible night school is a small

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Consortium of lay researchers and

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Scholars pursuing the study and

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exploration of ufology high strangeness

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and the phenomenon ins is not a monolith

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we represent varied ideas backgrounds

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disciplines and experiences and seek to

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engage in good faith dialogue with other

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curious minds tonight we are having one

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of our long awaited open lines episodes

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uh basically how this works is we'll be

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sharing out the stream yard link I've

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posted it in the chat in the YouTube

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chat right now feel free to jump on the

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stream it's totally cool if you only

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want to join with audio you don't have

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to join on video the Only Rule is don't

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be a jerk is not a democracy this is a

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benevolent dictatorship and if you're a

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jerk I'm kicking you off my show and

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we're all going to talk [\h__\h] about you

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in the green room after so don't be like

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that

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um anyway without any further delay I am

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delighted to welcome my co-hosts on this

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evening of course I have Lewis how are

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you friend

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good how are you oh it's just another

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day in paradise

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I have Campbell

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hello how are you oh you already said

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that yes good good and doing better I'm

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gonna break out all the things I say

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when I'm on client calls and work calls

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to talk about how good I am

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um and of course our resident dubious

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Layman who is

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um so lovingly missed from Twitter right

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um better than I deserve nice I have

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I've probably close to 20 of these

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little business bro responses that I've

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picked up in my slow jaunt through

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Venture Capital the last few years the

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I'm very good at it

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today was an eventful day right it's a

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bicycle day right the 80th anniversary

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of um

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the LSD trip that uh was enjoyed by

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Albert Hoffman what are you talking

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about yeah I'm serious I'm into it but I

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don't know about this yeah oh okay um

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yeah so obviously 420 the international

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cannabis holiday

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um but yeah 419 bicycle day this is the

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day that Albert Hoffman uh took his 250

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microgram dose of LSD 80 years ago

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um and uh subsequently went on to change

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the world if anyone hasn't read it his

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book LSD my problem child is a really

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interesting exploration of both his

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experiences with LSD and sort of his

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Reflections on basically introducing

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this substance to the population he was

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at Sandos Laboratories at that time

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um and so this is generally celebrated

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among the Psychonauts as being something

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of a international holiday

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um

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that's pretty cool I didn't know that I

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had actually just read a paper by Eric

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Davis not the one from UFO stuff from

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Consciousness stuff and he's talking

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about how um like Foucault went to

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California in the uh 70s and was like

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doing LSD and changed his perspective on

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a lot of his philosophy and I'd never

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heard that and I took a philosophy a

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major I knew who co-was but you know

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there's so much going on in the

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Psychedelic space that's sort of

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completely separated from everything

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else

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Yes actually there's a wonderful article

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I believe it was in the baffler a couple

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years ago basically about fuku doing LSD

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in Death Valley California highly

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recommended reading for anyone who's

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interested in sort of psychonaut

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literature and I also want to pump Eric

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Davis not UFO Eric Davis but other Eric

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Davis who wrote High weirdness

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um technosis and

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um oh man he wrote something else he's

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great though he's written a lot

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basically on high strangeness weirdness

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actually UFO culture his book High

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weirdness talks a lot about

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um emergent psychedelic and ufology and

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spirituality and New Age stuff in the

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70s and how it's come on to shape uh

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kind of counterculture now definitely

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recommended reading

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um I'd love to get going on here maybe

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yeah that's great dude I would love to

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have him on you were just you're just

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all watch me fan girl and fun for two

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hours

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all right let's do it yeah okay yes

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um

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and besides that it was an eventful day

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in the UFO world right we had uh the

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hearings today the long awaited much

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anticipated hearings that seemed

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um as they are want to do to

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collectively piss off all of UFO Twitter

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uh for many many reasons I'm sure

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um what did you guys think who tuned in

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and watched any of it well uh well hold

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on I since I since I don't know what is

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the kind of General consensus on UFO

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Twitter right now

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so I've seen a number of

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um push like responses the first was

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basically that

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um people felt that uh what's his name

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Sean Kirkpatrick

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um was kg or either huge person who was

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being kiji or I've heard speculation of

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course that he was being stymied

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deliberately stymied

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he is not finding the collaboration from

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external departments that he has been

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seeking in his work in his position

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okay

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I mean that's understandable I I we

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spoke earlier I said I was uh I was

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watching on a double speed so he

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definitely did look cagey to me but I

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think that was more of a symptom of the

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speed I was watching

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um I thought personally I thought

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you know that

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I couldn't I didn't take much away from

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this hearing you know what I mean it was

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more you know we have uh a large

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majority that are reported that our

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mundane things I think he said they yeah

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the majority of reports that Arrow

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receives are um of maintained

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characteristics much like a you know

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balloon or quadcopter or things like

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that which we were saying earlier I

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think really speaks to the effect of how

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easily and how frequently these what we

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call trained observers do misidentify

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things in the air

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um it apparently happens a lot and and I

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think I also said most ufologists will

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agree with that that most UFO cases are

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misidentifications or hoaxes but again I

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think that rarely speaks to the fact

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that how easy it is to misunder

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misidentify these things and you know

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genuinely believe you're seeing

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something Anonymous and report it

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obviously you wouldn't report it

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otherwise but

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it just goes to show you

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yeah well you know like from the start

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with um you know Dr jail and heinek like

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he ended up saying there's like a five

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percent residual of cases uh that he

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thinks are like unexplained oh I don't

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know about they can't explain a bull but

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unexplained and uh maybe defy content

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conventional explanation

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um I what I think is interesting about

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the way the government has communicated

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on the UFO subject in recent years is

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that they've actually started leaving uh

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sort of more ambiguity than they used to

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in a way that I find almost uh I mean in

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some respects it could be seen as

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troubling because their own internal

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documents that have been Declassified

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through a legitimate process to suggest

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they are they don't really want people

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to be uh sort of believing in conspiracy

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and things like that so they want to be

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as unambiguous as possible so like uh

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today Dr Patrick did use language like

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he was saying um you know a vast

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majority but you know you could go into

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the most um extreme fringes of UFO uh

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you know study and uh people who believe

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that it's the most extreme uh

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possibility out there would say that

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um have there well I actually have two

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things to say the first is that when it

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comes to the reliability of trained

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observers

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um the analogy that comes to mind is

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um

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the difference between studying of

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foreign language in a classroom or

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academic setting and actually

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functionally using that language in a

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lived experience and I bring this up

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because

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um I think that

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there's a lot of noise and context and

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complexity to even as a trained Observer

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appropriately identifying things in

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one's environment that can be that can

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present circumstances and environmental

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factors that may not frequently exist

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right even just like atmospheric

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phenomena or whether phenomena or

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someone being tired things like that and

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this doesn't necessarily make trained

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observers useless at all it just makes

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them fallible right and human beings

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even very well trained human beings are

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fallible this is why airplanes have

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pilots and co-pilots because

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um you know there's you frequently need

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another skilled or trained person in the

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event not only of an issue but also

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um as a second individual to contribute

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judgment and assess circumstances and

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this is also something I mean to note

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here this is something that human brains

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are still extremely extremely good at

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compared to artificial intelligence and

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classification we're very good at making

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decisions

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um in complex circumstances and complex

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environments and it feels to me like

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when we're relying on just one

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individual trained Observer to

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categorically make an assessment about

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something that may be an anomalous

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that's an undue amount of pressure or

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stress or Reliance on

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um it basically like the fallibility of

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human cognition and human recognition

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um

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I I don't know too much about how this

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training is done or if there's basically

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like uh the equivalent of like pair

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programming where you have two people

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watching stuff to corroborate

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um but I I do think it's important to

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say that like fallibility in this

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circumstances not is just an artifact of

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human availability it doesn't

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necessarily mean there's a hoax or

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there's

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um malicious intent

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actually even said that um military

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Pilots uh make relatively poor

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um judges of

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uh poor observers because they're kind

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of oriented towards seeing things as a

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threat and responding quickly and um so

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the Soviets actually did their own study

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00:12:24,949 --> 00:12:23,160
and they came to a similar conclusion

282
00:12:26,930 --> 00:12:24,959
because like a lot of their pilots were

283
00:12:28,430 --> 00:12:26,940
being all of their military was

284
00:12:31,430 --> 00:12:28,440
basically

285
00:12:32,810 --> 00:12:31,440
told to act as like a giant UFO um

286
00:12:34,430 --> 00:12:32,820
reporting

287
00:12:36,949 --> 00:12:34,440
um apparatus

288
00:12:38,750 --> 00:12:36,959
and um so they had a lot of data to work

289
00:12:40,430 --> 00:12:38,760
with but they did like some follow-on

290
00:12:42,889 --> 00:12:40,440
studies and they found that military

291
00:12:45,829 --> 00:12:42,899
Pilots were often misidentifying like

292
00:12:47,629 --> 00:12:45,839
meteorites and Celestial atmospheric

293
00:12:50,090 --> 00:12:47,639
phenomena

294
00:12:52,850 --> 00:12:50,100
so yeah that sort of re recapitulated

295
00:12:56,210 --> 00:12:52,860
the high neck assessment

296
00:12:58,610 --> 00:12:56,220
the in aviation in general redundancy is

297
00:13:01,190 --> 00:12:58,620
seen as critical and being a

298
00:13:03,710 --> 00:13:01,200
professional involves knowing that

299
00:13:07,870 --> 00:13:03,720
redundancy is critical like I don't get

300
00:13:10,550 --> 00:13:07,880
into a Boeing because it has the best

301
00:13:12,650 --> 00:13:10,560
engine like you know get into it because

302
00:13:14,090 --> 00:13:12,660
it has four of the best engines and the

303
00:13:16,129 --> 00:13:14,100
likelihood of them all failing is very

304
00:13:17,750 --> 00:13:16,139
low but the Boeing operator Engineers

305
00:13:18,769 --> 00:13:17,760
know that there's a chance of any one of

306
00:13:21,829 --> 00:13:18,779
them failing

307
00:13:24,350 --> 00:13:21,839
so you know there's always this the

308
00:13:26,449 --> 00:13:24,360
probability or certainty of error built

309
00:13:29,389 --> 00:13:26,459
into systems and it does show sort of

310
00:13:31,009 --> 00:13:29,399
the underlying bias when you kind of

311
00:13:32,449 --> 00:13:31,019
erase that I think it should be

312
00:13:37,250 --> 00:13:32,459
emphasized by somebody who wants to

313
00:13:41,530 --> 00:13:38,050
um

314
00:13:45,769 --> 00:13:41,540
are any of you guys familiar with

315
00:13:48,170 --> 00:13:45,779
heuristics for filtering out

316
00:13:51,050 --> 00:13:48,180
uh misidentifications and separating

317
00:13:53,509 --> 00:13:51,060
them from what is believed to be truly

318
00:13:58,129 --> 00:13:53,519
anomalous phenomena

319
00:14:01,009 --> 00:13:58,139
like criteria or the five observables

320
00:14:02,930 --> 00:14:01,019
Leah what do you mean right so I

321
00:14:05,750 --> 00:14:02,940
remember I'm from the psychospiritual

322
00:14:07,310 --> 00:14:05,760
Consciousness lens yeah well it's worth

323
00:14:09,530 --> 00:14:07,320
looking at those though because like

324
00:14:12,470 --> 00:14:09,540
when I've gotten into the like looking

325
00:14:14,810 --> 00:14:12,480
at the UFO cases the nature of the five

326
00:14:16,970 --> 00:14:14,820
observables don't even necessarily like

327
00:14:19,370 --> 00:14:16,980
add up to me as being consistent with

328
00:14:21,470 --> 00:14:19,380
like what could be like a you know real

329
00:14:22,970 --> 00:14:21,480
UFO or whatever like it's not necessary

330
00:14:23,690 --> 00:14:22,980
that it demonstrate essentially any of

331
00:14:25,850 --> 00:14:23,700
them

332
00:14:28,009 --> 00:14:25,860
um so and Elizondo says he's not a UFO

333
00:14:30,170 --> 00:14:28,019
guy like the former director of the you

334
00:14:32,810 --> 00:14:30,180
know the Pentagon brand whatever anyway

335
00:14:33,829 --> 00:14:32,820
we know who Elizondo is he says uh you

336
00:14:35,150 --> 00:14:33,839
know that he doesn't know about UFO

337
00:14:36,230 --> 00:14:35,160
stuff but then he's like putting these

338
00:14:38,230 --> 00:14:36,240
things out there I get the sensitive

339
00:14:41,449 --> 00:14:38,240
sort of came up with them on the fly

340
00:14:42,889 --> 00:14:41,459
yeah so for the edification of both

341
00:14:44,810 --> 00:14:42,899
myself and our audience the five

342
00:14:46,449 --> 00:14:44,820
observables can be categorized as

343
00:14:49,550 --> 00:14:46,459
follows this is according to to the

344
00:14:52,550 --> 00:14:49,560
stars.media uh well known institution of

345
00:14:55,069 --> 00:14:52,560
intellectual and Atmospheric phenomena

346
00:14:57,470 --> 00:14:55,079
um the first just a sudden instantaneous

347
00:15:00,650 --> 00:14:57,480
acceleration the second Hypersonic

348
00:15:02,569 --> 00:15:00,660
velocities without signatures so

349
00:15:04,610 --> 00:15:02,579
signatures in this instance are

350
00:15:07,730 --> 00:15:04,620
characterized as acoustic heat or

351
00:15:10,790 --> 00:15:07,740
electromagnetic basically aftermaths

352
00:15:13,090 --> 00:15:10,800
then low observability so descriptions

353
00:15:15,730 --> 00:15:13,100
by Witnesses are difficult to describe

354
00:15:18,170 --> 00:15:15,740
electronic equipment associated with

355
00:15:19,850 --> 00:15:18,180
observing the phenomena becomes jammed

356
00:15:21,050 --> 00:15:19,860
or doesn't register what's actually

357
00:15:24,170 --> 00:15:21,060
being seen

358
00:15:26,810 --> 00:15:24,180
trans medium travel so

359
00:15:28,310 --> 00:15:26,820
um this would be the ability to travel

360
00:15:30,290 --> 00:15:28,320
easily in various environments and

361
00:15:32,689 --> 00:15:30,300
conditions and then finally a positive

362
00:15:34,850 --> 00:15:32,699
lift objects that are apparently

363
00:15:37,009 --> 00:15:34,860
resisting the natural effects of Earth's

364
00:15:38,150 --> 00:15:37,019
gravity which is kind of interesting a

365
00:15:39,350 --> 00:15:38,160
lot of these feel like they're kind of

366
00:15:43,129 --> 00:15:39,360
there's a lot of overlap in the Venn

367
00:15:46,329 --> 00:15:43,139
diagram of these uh these traits I like

368
00:15:50,269 --> 00:15:46,339
that low observability is one of them

369
00:15:52,069 --> 00:15:50,279
it's like implicitous cover your ass

370
00:15:55,310 --> 00:15:52,079
kind of like

371
00:15:56,930 --> 00:15:55,320
yeah keep it nice and ambiguous

372
00:15:58,550 --> 00:15:56,940
yeah it's kind of like a snake eating

373
00:16:00,590 --> 00:15:58,560
its own tail there where it's like a UFO

374
00:16:05,030 --> 00:16:00,600
is something that is hard to resolve

375
00:16:06,590 --> 00:16:05,040
it's like yes and like I I like these

376
00:16:08,509 --> 00:16:06,600
comment here that the five observables

377
00:16:10,550 --> 00:16:08,519
for Leah are five of the seven chakras

378
00:16:15,590 --> 00:16:10,560
okay so first of all there's a lot more

379
00:16:19,730 --> 00:16:18,050
um there's there's a lot of chakras

380
00:16:22,430 --> 00:16:19,740
um not just seven that we know of

381
00:16:23,750 --> 00:16:22,440
through the Western like yoga schools

382
00:16:25,790 --> 00:16:23,760
um and that's all I'll say about that

383
00:16:32,170 --> 00:16:25,800
because this is open lines not Leah's

384
00:16:35,629 --> 00:16:34,250
we don't have anyone in the green room

385
00:16:36,949 --> 00:16:35,639
right now but I'm gonna throw the stream

386
00:16:38,629 --> 00:16:36,959
yard Link in

387
00:16:40,069 --> 00:16:38,639
um obviously any of our audience members

388
00:16:41,449 --> 00:16:40,079
feel free to drop in we'd love to talk

389
00:16:43,790 --> 00:16:41,459
to you guys especially if you have

390
00:16:45,110 --> 00:16:43,800
thoughts about hearings today do you

391
00:16:47,449 --> 00:16:45,120
have any cases you want to discuss even

392
00:16:49,610 --> 00:16:47,459
just anything about high strangeness

393
00:16:51,590 --> 00:16:49,620
um the point of open lines of course is

394
00:16:53,210 --> 00:16:51,600
unscreened anyone can jump on and

395
00:16:54,829 --> 00:16:53,220
contribute

396
00:16:57,350 --> 00:16:54,839
um so let me go ahead and drop that link

397
00:16:58,670 --> 00:16:57,360
in here yeah well I'd like to hear about

398
00:17:02,030 --> 00:16:58,680
just whatever

399
00:17:03,829 --> 00:17:02,040
um I I would uh enjoy if maybe someone

400
00:17:05,809 --> 00:17:03,839
from the believer perspective uh would

401
00:17:07,669 --> 00:17:05,819
call in and tell me their opinion on the

402
00:17:09,169 --> 00:17:07,679
hearings I want to

403
00:17:11,929 --> 00:17:09,179
see what other people thought of that

404
00:17:13,549 --> 00:17:11,939
too because yeah I have my own biases of

405
00:17:16,189 --> 00:17:13,559
course so I like to hear other

406
00:17:20,329 --> 00:17:18,829
yeah and uh I've got uh the live uh

407
00:17:22,549 --> 00:17:20,339
briefing here so maybe I'll do a

408
00:17:25,130 --> 00:17:22,559
presentation and share that Tab and we

409
00:17:29,330 --> 00:17:25,140
can take a look at this uh chart that Dr

410
00:17:29,340 --> 00:17:34,190
okay I'll just take me a second here

411
00:17:37,669 --> 00:17:36,289
take your time man

412
00:17:39,169 --> 00:17:37,679
yeah

413
00:17:44,470 --> 00:17:39,179
okay can you see that

414
00:17:48,470 --> 00:17:44,480
yes okay so Envision it yes

415
00:17:51,190 --> 00:17:48,480
perfect okay so what do we got here

416
00:17:54,230 --> 00:17:51,200
all right typically reported uip

417
00:17:56,330 --> 00:17:54,240
characteristics and reported UA hot

418
00:17:57,590 --> 00:17:56,340
spots uh I think that that's like a

419
00:17:58,850 --> 00:17:57,600
important distinction to make when

420
00:18:02,870 --> 00:17:58,860
you're looking at these things these are

421
00:18:04,610 --> 00:18:02,880
about UAP reports not just uip sightings

422
00:18:07,370 --> 00:18:04,620
or UAP hot spots like these aren't

423
00:18:09,110 --> 00:18:07,380
necessarily flaps taking place on this

424
00:18:11,330 --> 00:18:09,120
map these are just

425
00:18:13,190 --> 00:18:11,340
um the concentration of reports and in

426
00:18:15,950 --> 00:18:13,200
fact I think Kirkpatrick uh mentioned

427
00:18:18,110 --> 00:18:15,960
that these these bright areas on the map

428
00:18:20,270 --> 00:18:18,120
here are where their bases are

429
00:18:21,590 --> 00:18:20,280
essentially are what some of their

430
00:18:22,970 --> 00:18:21,600
larger bases where they're getting a lot

431
00:18:24,710 --> 00:18:22,980
of the reports in

432
00:18:26,990 --> 00:18:24,720
I thought that was neat yeah he

433
00:18:29,450 --> 00:18:27,000
mentioned several times that a lot of it

434
00:18:32,450 --> 00:18:29,460
is uh reporting bias he mentioned how

435
00:18:34,250 --> 00:18:32,460
the altitude is the altitude of most air

436
00:18:36,529 --> 00:18:34,260
traffic because that's where people are

437
00:18:38,029 --> 00:18:36,539
seeing things and then he mentioned that

438
00:18:39,890 --> 00:18:38,039
a lot of the observations are near

439
00:18:41,810 --> 00:18:39,900
places where they have the sensor

440
00:18:43,430 --> 00:18:41,820
systems that enable the observation so

441
00:18:45,470 --> 00:18:43,440
it's really drawing attention to that

442
00:18:46,970 --> 00:18:45,480
yeah it makes sense but I think that

443
00:18:49,850 --> 00:18:46,980
someone could look at that and be like

444
00:18:52,010 --> 00:18:49,860
oh why are you AP drawn to these

445
00:18:53,750 --> 00:18:52,020
locations you know what I mean people

446
00:18:56,390 --> 00:18:53,760
could people could take a lot from that

447
00:18:57,950 --> 00:18:56,400
I think the way it's worded is maybe not

448
00:18:59,690 --> 00:18:57,960
necessarily so clear

449
00:19:04,610 --> 00:18:59,700
yeah

450
00:19:06,950 --> 00:19:04,620
um kind of numbers here is really

451
00:19:08,710 --> 00:19:06,960
interesting look at

452
00:19:11,750 --> 00:19:08,720
it's a little blurry from it 52

453
00:19:13,370 --> 00:19:11,760
described as round

454
00:19:14,289 --> 00:19:13,380
I would call that balloon-like entities

455
00:19:18,350 --> 00:19:14,299
right

456
00:19:21,110 --> 00:19:18,360
yeah yeah last report uh one to four

457
00:19:22,370 --> 00:19:21,120
meters silver white or translucent I

458
00:19:24,590 --> 00:19:22,380
mean are you are you getting like

459
00:19:26,630 --> 00:19:24,600
screaming Impressions Campbell

460
00:19:28,789 --> 00:19:26,640
uh I did mention that in the Discord

461
00:19:30,110 --> 00:19:28,799
earlier that um something like that

462
00:19:31,970 --> 00:19:30,120
could probably resolve a lot of these

463
00:19:34,310 --> 00:19:31,980
but I think you're right that almost all

464
00:19:36,230 --> 00:19:34,320
uh that would be a very rare phenomenon

465
00:19:38,390 --> 00:19:36,240
and has not been verified in the

466
00:19:40,310 --> 00:19:38,400
atmosphere it's basically like a spin-up

467
00:19:41,810 --> 00:19:40,320
of electromagnetic energy kind of like a

468
00:19:44,390 --> 00:19:41,820
three-dimensional

469
00:19:46,490 --> 00:19:44,400
um like uh hurricane almost right it

470
00:19:48,529 --> 00:19:46,500
stays intact but um that would be very

471
00:19:51,529 --> 00:19:48,539
unlikely I think most probably are uh

472
00:19:54,289 --> 00:19:51,539
probably balloons I suspect

473
00:19:56,510 --> 00:19:54,299
now uh what at the bottom of this chart

474
00:19:57,890 --> 00:19:56,520
here in the uh the signatures section

475
00:19:59,990 --> 00:19:57,900
the thermal

476
00:20:01,610 --> 00:20:00,000
and they say intermittent short way or

477
00:20:03,470 --> 00:20:01,620
shortwave infrared and medium wave

478
00:20:05,029 --> 00:20:03,480
infrared and what do you know what this

479
00:20:07,970 --> 00:20:05,039
means

480
00:20:09,669 --> 00:20:07,980
what they're referring to here

481
00:20:11,409 --> 00:20:09,679
yeah

482
00:20:13,850 --> 00:20:11,419
okay

483
00:20:14,990 --> 00:20:13,860
sorry yes

484
00:20:16,549 --> 00:20:15,000
um I was gonna say they're probably

485
00:20:20,270 --> 00:20:16,559
talking like literally a thermal

486
00:20:22,430 --> 00:20:20,280
signatures so these are um like the

487
00:20:27,529 --> 00:20:22,440
intensity of the heat or heat radiation

488
00:20:33,650 --> 00:20:30,409
they're emitting the thermal these

489
00:20:36,350 --> 00:20:33,660
thermal signatures so but um does that

490
00:20:38,270 --> 00:20:36,360
contradict I mean maybe not contradict

491
00:20:41,150 --> 00:20:38,280
but um

492
00:20:43,190 --> 00:20:41,160
no thermal exhaust and then it says

493
00:20:46,250 --> 00:20:43,200
thermal

494
00:20:49,070 --> 00:20:46,260
well I mean the observables the

495
00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:54,529
computer they do talk about

496
00:20:58,909 --> 00:20:57,110
no obvious signatures but the thing is

497
00:21:00,890 --> 00:20:58,919
like an infrared signature is something

498
00:21:02,810 --> 00:21:00,900
you wouldn't be able to visually observe

499
00:21:04,190 --> 00:21:02,820
you'd have to be able to be measured

500
00:21:05,810 --> 00:21:04,200
through instrumentation because we can't

501
00:21:07,970 --> 00:21:05,820
really see into the infrared spectrum

502
00:21:10,970 --> 00:21:07,980
and we wouldn't be close enough to feel

503
00:21:12,770 --> 00:21:10,980
like a heat signature either however I

504
00:21:14,090 --> 00:21:12,780
mean you know there are reports of

505
00:21:16,070 --> 00:21:14,100
course that people that have Close

506
00:21:18,289 --> 00:21:16,080
Encounters that do experience Burns

507
00:21:20,630 --> 00:21:18,299
right that there are these these thermal

508
00:21:22,430 --> 00:21:20,640
signatures or uh you know the saucer

509
00:21:24,710 --> 00:21:22,440
Nest phenomena right like leaving little

510
00:21:26,930 --> 00:21:24,720
burn marks on the ground

511
00:21:30,110 --> 00:21:26,940
yes um

512
00:21:32,570 --> 00:21:30,120
there's also the um with the balloons

513
00:21:35,149 --> 00:21:32,580
um they're the Chinese balloons of

514
00:21:37,490 --> 00:21:35,159
recent fame

515
00:21:38,810 --> 00:21:37,500
um they are they apparently can't steer

516
00:21:42,169 --> 00:21:38,820
themselves but they don't have any

517
00:21:44,450 --> 00:21:42,179
obvious means of propulsion so like that

518
00:21:47,210 --> 00:21:44,460
might not show up even on as like an

519
00:21:48,409 --> 00:21:47,220
obvious Heat Signature in the yeah that

520
00:21:50,090 --> 00:21:48,419
may be how they're able to be so

521
00:21:52,610 --> 00:21:50,100
stealthy right you just shoot them up

522
00:21:55,310 --> 00:21:52,620
into the I mean the joke stream uh I

523
00:21:57,169 --> 00:21:55,320
mean are our predictive capabilities are

524
00:21:58,730 --> 00:21:57,179
imperfect but they're quite good like we

525
00:22:01,850 --> 00:21:58,740
understand how a lot of these like

526
00:22:03,350 --> 00:22:01,860
atmospheric streams work so you can you

527
00:22:05,029 --> 00:22:03,360
know depending on I would assume the

528
00:22:07,010 --> 00:22:05,039
altitude and the location from which you

529
00:22:08,810 --> 00:22:07,020
launch them you can expect that they'll

530
00:22:10,669 --> 00:22:08,820
move in particular ways through the

531
00:22:12,830 --> 00:22:10,679
atmosphere and over particular places

532
00:22:13,970 --> 00:22:12,840
geographically

533
00:22:16,490 --> 00:22:13,980
mm-hmm

534
00:22:19,669 --> 00:22:16,500
and these are hot spots the one on the

535
00:22:21,830 --> 00:22:19,679
far right there is that near that Korea

536
00:22:23,870 --> 00:22:21,840
it looks like South Korean to me yeah

537
00:22:26,510 --> 00:22:23,880
that's like a place where there's a lot

538
00:22:28,130 --> 00:22:26,520
of U.S military activity and correct

539
00:22:30,350 --> 00:22:28,140
South Korean military because they're

540
00:22:32,630 --> 00:22:30,360
like on hair trigger a lot for any North

541
00:22:33,409 --> 00:22:32,640
Korean attack and

542
00:22:35,149 --> 00:22:33,419
um

543
00:22:37,789 --> 00:22:35,159
just in that general area there's a lot

544
00:22:40,730 --> 00:22:37,799
of U.S shipping as well Naval shipping

545
00:22:42,950 --> 00:22:40,740
because of uh content trying to contain

546
00:22:44,149 --> 00:22:42,960
China and then in the middle there it

547
00:22:46,789 --> 00:22:44,159
looks like the middle that's the Middle

548
00:22:48,610 --> 00:22:46,799
East isn't it or near turkey yeah turkey

549
00:22:51,409 --> 00:22:48,620
and stuff so yeah

550
00:22:54,350 --> 00:22:51,419
there are a bit of U.S bases in Turkey

551
00:22:56,210 --> 00:22:54,360
and in that region just under um

552
00:22:57,529 --> 00:22:56,220
Russia there

553
00:22:59,870 --> 00:22:57,539
yeah

554
00:23:03,169 --> 00:22:59,880
and then a lot of got our coasts

555
00:23:06,110 --> 00:23:03,179
a lot of the follow-up questions did uh

556
00:23:09,529 --> 00:23:06,120
from the Senators involved did it relate

557
00:23:13,070 --> 00:23:09,539
to uh foreign technology specifically

558
00:23:14,990 --> 00:23:13,080
asking about China and they seemed very

559
00:23:17,690 --> 00:23:15,000
distinctly interested in this

560
00:23:20,690 --> 00:23:17,700
possibility that there could be some

561
00:23:23,630 --> 00:23:20,700
kind of uh element of foreign technology

562
00:23:27,710 --> 00:23:23,640
invading their airspace and the Dr

563
00:23:31,070 --> 00:23:27,720
Kirkpatrick specifically brought up uh

564
00:23:32,870 --> 00:23:31,080
or uh Senator uh gillibrand uh mentioned

565
00:23:35,149 --> 00:23:32,880
that she was going to have uh Dr

566
00:23:37,730 --> 00:23:35,159
Kirkpatrick help her draft some of the

567
00:23:40,730 --> 00:23:37,740
language explicitly in the next uh

568
00:23:42,950 --> 00:23:40,740
defense bill in order to allocate

569
00:23:46,250 --> 00:23:42,960
resources really and that was after some

570
00:23:48,710 --> 00:23:46,260
questions about missing these most

571
00:23:51,590 --> 00:23:48,720
dangerous very high level possible

572
00:23:54,350 --> 00:23:51,600
Technologies being used by the like

573
00:23:55,970 --> 00:23:54,360
foreign adversaries on Earth so like

574
00:23:57,289 --> 00:23:55,980
they're they're leaving open this option

575
00:23:59,810 --> 00:23:57,299
of there being these like very

576
00:24:01,909 --> 00:23:59,820
extraordinary phenomena but the way that

577
00:24:03,350 --> 00:24:01,919
they're talking about it it's removed

578
00:24:05,149 --> 00:24:03,360
from the historical thing that people

579
00:24:07,250 --> 00:24:05,159
think of as UFOs because these

580
00:24:08,810 --> 00:24:07,260
technologies that they're now saying

581
00:24:10,310 --> 00:24:08,820
they're looking for are possible and

582
00:24:12,289 --> 00:24:10,320
historically haven't been but sort of

583
00:24:13,970 --> 00:24:12,299
the study of

584
00:24:17,029 --> 00:24:13,980
objects are sort of continued through

585
00:24:19,549 --> 00:24:17,039
the period into when the things that

586
00:24:21,409 --> 00:24:19,559
were historically inconceivable now seem

587
00:24:24,649 --> 00:24:21,419
like actually within the realm of

588
00:24:29,390 --> 00:24:24,659
possibilities so so once like what was

589
00:24:31,970 --> 00:24:29,400
once uh absurd levels of hypothetical uh

590
00:24:33,770 --> 00:24:31,980
foreign technology and management now

591
00:24:35,870 --> 00:24:33,780
are within the realm of possibility and

592
00:24:38,090 --> 00:24:35,880
drastically and it's potentially causing

593
00:24:40,490 --> 00:24:38,100
some things to slip through the cracks

594
00:24:43,310 --> 00:24:40,500
because of that taboo associated with

595
00:24:46,250 --> 00:24:43,320
his reporting historically

596
00:24:48,230 --> 00:24:46,260
so it's a big mess isn't it

597
00:24:49,730 --> 00:24:48,240
seems to be

598
00:24:51,529 --> 00:24:49,740
let's see here yeah there were some

599
00:24:53,090 --> 00:24:51,539
interesting parts of it um I guess I

600
00:24:55,610 --> 00:24:53,100
can't really find this hey I think did I

601
00:24:59,210 --> 00:24:55,620
just did you steal the presentation I

602
00:25:00,950 --> 00:24:59,220
think I did you did yeah I so I put this

603
00:25:03,110 --> 00:25:00,960
up in the background this was an image

604
00:25:05,149 --> 00:25:03,120
that was making the rounds on Twitter uh

605
00:25:07,490 --> 00:25:05,159
probably like six months ago or five

606
00:25:10,130 --> 00:25:07,500
months ago it comes in Cycles I've seen

607
00:25:14,149 --> 00:25:10,140
this a lot yeah and I just bring it up

608
00:25:15,590 --> 00:25:14,159
to um obviously I can speak to its uh

609
00:25:18,070 --> 00:25:15,600
origination point I don't know who made

610
00:25:20,570 --> 00:25:18,080
it I don't I guess esri whatever that is

611
00:25:23,750 --> 00:25:20,580
the feeder data

612
00:25:26,930 --> 00:25:23,760
um but I I bring this up because uh

613
00:25:29,750 --> 00:25:26,940
it's a very Stark

614
00:25:31,669 --> 00:25:29,760
um it's not really a heat map but it's

615
00:25:33,350 --> 00:25:31,679
kind of you know the point is it's very

616
00:25:34,850 --> 00:25:33,360
Stark look at look at all of North

617
00:25:37,370 --> 00:25:34,860
America versus the rest of the world

618
00:25:40,070 --> 00:25:37,380
Nick tell me about what you're saying

619
00:25:41,330 --> 00:25:40,080
however uh first of all like I said I've

620
00:25:42,830 --> 00:25:41,340
seen this map quite a few times and

621
00:25:45,169 --> 00:25:42,840
actually these the source of the

622
00:25:47,269 --> 00:25:45,179
information comes from the National UFO

623
00:25:50,090 --> 00:25:47,279
Reporting Center National media right so

624
00:25:52,730 --> 00:25:50,100
it's America National and it's also as

625
00:25:55,390 --> 00:25:52,740
you can see reported UFO sightings now

626
00:25:59,450 --> 00:25:55,400
all these dark countries I don't know

627
00:26:01,610 --> 00:25:59,460
UFO Reporting fantastic or anything but

628
00:26:03,950 --> 00:26:01,620
like I said uh that information is

629
00:26:06,230 --> 00:26:03,960
primarily coming from the US which is

630
00:26:07,610 --> 00:26:06,240
why it's glowing so brightly on that map

631
00:26:10,010 --> 00:26:07,620
I remember

632
00:26:13,130 --> 00:26:10,020
um this was I want to say it was two

633
00:26:14,990 --> 00:26:13,140
years ago Mick West uh retweeted this

634
00:26:16,970 --> 00:26:15,000
and I was like hey man look where that

635
00:26:18,890 --> 00:26:16,980
information is coming from Fantastic

636
00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:18,900
Nick thank you so much no I genuinely

637
00:26:22,190 --> 00:26:20,700
appreciate this context because like I

638
00:26:23,690 --> 00:26:22,200
said I don't really know anything about

639
00:26:26,149 --> 00:26:23,700
it except that I see it kind of making

640
00:26:28,549 --> 00:26:26,159
the rounds on social media so um I'm

641
00:26:30,890 --> 00:26:28,559
gonna kick this off the stream Campbell

642
00:26:32,230 --> 00:26:30,900
so you can represent uh what you were

643
00:26:34,610 --> 00:26:32,240
sharing

644
00:26:36,409 --> 00:26:34,620
it kind of speaks to what I was saying a

645
00:26:39,010 --> 00:26:36,419
little earlier about the uh the graphs

646
00:26:42,049 --> 00:26:39,020
from the hearing too is that it's

647
00:26:43,130 --> 00:26:42,059
reported UFO cases not UFO cases this

648
00:26:45,110 --> 00:26:43,140
isn't a

649
00:26:47,330 --> 00:26:45,120
um these aren't like hot spots these

650
00:26:48,950 --> 00:26:47,340
aren't waves necessarily these are just

651
00:26:51,350 --> 00:26:48,960
the location that the reports themselves

652
00:26:53,149 --> 00:26:51,360
are coming from which you know they are

653
00:26:54,830 --> 00:26:53,159
being directed to report this stuff now

654
00:26:55,850 --> 00:26:54,840
that's kind of like the agenda of this

655
00:26:58,190 --> 00:26:55,860
office

656
00:27:00,830 --> 00:26:58,200
so that would be why you have these

657
00:27:02,930 --> 00:27:00,840
glowing bases on this map of you know

658
00:27:04,669 --> 00:27:02,940
UFO reports that that's where they're

659
00:27:05,750 --> 00:27:04,679
going and getting them from

660
00:27:07,430 --> 00:27:05,760
so I don't know if it's really

661
00:27:10,250 --> 00:27:07,440
indicative of anything or if it's even

662
00:27:13,190 --> 00:27:10,260
that valuable right information this is

663
00:27:15,169 --> 00:27:13,200
so interesting yes very very helpful

664
00:27:16,730 --> 00:27:15,179
context thank you

665
00:27:19,130 --> 00:27:16,740
yeah and it's funny too because it's

666
00:27:21,890 --> 00:27:19,140
like uh it's about the ones that are

667
00:27:24,649 --> 00:27:21,900
unresolved after investigation right so

668
00:27:26,390 --> 00:27:24,659
if it's just observations then like yes

669
00:27:28,610 --> 00:27:26,400
certainly they're going to be appearing

670
00:27:30,610 --> 00:27:28,620
where people are so

671
00:27:34,789 --> 00:27:30,620
um like

672
00:27:36,830 --> 00:27:34,799
it's just so key to avoid like like I

673
00:27:38,870 --> 00:27:36,840
understand the compulsion to support the

674
00:27:41,269 --> 00:27:38,880
uh opinion right like it's like if

675
00:27:43,909 --> 00:27:41,279
there's good evidence that there are

676
00:27:45,590 --> 00:27:43,919
like things being observed that uh can't

677
00:27:47,090 --> 00:27:45,600
be explained that's why this office is

678
00:27:48,830 --> 00:27:47,100
there is because there are it's like are

679
00:27:50,090 --> 00:27:48,840
these things like foreign technology

680
00:27:52,490 --> 00:27:50,100
because they are doing things that

681
00:27:53,930 --> 00:27:52,500
historically you haven't seen

682
00:27:56,930 --> 00:27:53,940
um you know but it's like if you want to

683
00:27:59,750 --> 00:27:56,940
get at that have to avoid these um

684
00:28:01,669 --> 00:27:59,760
misleading things like lead with the

685
00:28:04,669 --> 00:28:01,679
strongest information so that the

686
00:28:06,049 --> 00:28:04,679
conversation is taken seriously I agree

687
00:28:07,310 --> 00:28:06,059
and that makes that kind of brings me to

688
00:28:09,169 --> 00:28:07,320
the point that

689
00:28:10,310 --> 00:28:09,179
and and I kind of thought we'd talk

690
00:28:11,750 --> 00:28:10,320
about this a little bit more last week

691
00:28:13,549 --> 00:28:11,760
but um

692
00:28:17,690 --> 00:28:13,559
at what point

693
00:28:19,250 --> 00:28:17,700
do we take this um I want I'm I'm used

694
00:28:21,289 --> 00:28:19,260
to saying eth

695
00:28:24,590 --> 00:28:21,299
just because I'm older but this kind of

696
00:28:27,289 --> 00:28:24,600
like notion this uh this idea of

697
00:28:28,130 --> 00:28:27,299
non-human intelligence applied to

698
00:28:30,049 --> 00:28:28,140
um

699
00:28:32,090 --> 00:28:30,059
unidentified things but not just

700
00:28:34,250 --> 00:28:32,100
unidentified things specifically ones

701
00:28:35,930 --> 00:28:34,260
that are in the sky we don't we don't

702
00:28:37,610 --> 00:28:35,940
categorize or kind of believe that

703
00:28:39,350 --> 00:28:37,620
there's a unified theory between all

704
00:28:41,990 --> 00:28:39,360
unidentified things just the flying

705
00:28:45,350 --> 00:28:42,000
things when do we take this kind of like

706
00:28:47,630 --> 00:28:45,360
this NH nhi idea off the table because

707
00:28:49,789 --> 00:28:47,640
you were talking about earlier Campbell

708
00:28:51,230 --> 00:28:49,799
and uh Senator Joe brand was also

709
00:28:53,990 --> 00:28:51,240
talking about the stigma that's attached

710
00:28:56,510 --> 00:28:54,000
to all of this that stigma I'm assuming

711
00:28:59,330 --> 00:28:56,520
comes from the flying Foster Story right

712
00:29:01,370 --> 00:28:59,340
that's my understanding in this past 80

713
00:29:08,529 --> 00:29:01,380
years is there anything to even suggest

714
00:29:14,510 --> 00:29:11,750
my response to that is that

715
00:29:18,409 --> 00:29:14,520
um this is this is a great question in

716
00:29:19,930 --> 00:29:18,419
my response to it is that

717
00:29:20,510 --> 00:29:19,940
it is

718
00:29:21,350 --> 00:29:20,520
[Music]

719
00:29:23,810 --> 00:29:21,360
um

720
00:29:26,029 --> 00:29:23,820
there's an inappropriate in my mind

721
00:29:27,169 --> 00:29:26,039
connection between the material

722
00:29:32,269 --> 00:29:27,179
phenomena

723
00:29:39,409 --> 00:29:36,529
Etc and also uh non-human intelligence I

724
00:29:41,149 --> 00:29:39,419
see these as two categorically distinct

725
00:29:43,190 --> 00:29:41,159
inquiries

726
00:29:45,649 --> 00:29:43,200
um and I think that they become

727
00:29:47,870 --> 00:29:45,659
inappropriately and excessively linked

728
00:29:50,990 --> 00:29:47,880
both popularly and a lot of people that

729
00:29:53,149 --> 00:29:51,000
follow the subject I see the question of

730
00:29:55,130 --> 00:29:53,159
non-human intelligence as part of a

731
00:29:58,010 --> 00:29:55,140
larger constellation of inquiry even

732
00:29:59,750 --> 00:29:58,020
into the existence of God right yeah

733
00:30:01,549 --> 00:29:59,760
like that's what it feels like it's a

734
00:30:04,570 --> 00:30:01,559
modern artifact of this inquiry about

735
00:30:07,370 --> 00:30:04,580
whether or not God actually exists or

736
00:30:09,169 --> 00:30:07,380
realities beyond our immediate material

737
00:30:12,769 --> 00:30:09,179
based reality exist

738
00:30:14,389 --> 00:30:12,779
um and you know I I am personally of the

739
00:30:15,590 --> 00:30:14,399
camp right like we were left I think we

740
00:30:17,330 --> 00:30:15,600
were laughing about this backstage where

741
00:30:18,950 --> 00:30:17,340
I was like oh I even said this on this I

742
00:30:20,810 --> 00:30:18,960
think on the show tonight like I come

743
00:30:22,070 --> 00:30:20,820
from the psycho spiritual kind of junkie

744
00:30:23,570 --> 00:30:22,080
in perspective like I don't come at

745
00:30:26,930 --> 00:30:23,580
those from like the literal Flying

746
00:30:29,450 --> 00:30:26,940
Saucer see stuff in the sky perspective

747
00:30:32,450 --> 00:30:29,460
um and I think this proclivity to

748
00:30:37,490 --> 00:30:32,460
entangle these two things and treat them

749
00:30:39,710 --> 00:30:37,500
is uh one core idea actually does a

750
00:30:41,149 --> 00:30:39,720
disservice to the subject in a lot of

751
00:30:43,430 --> 00:30:41,159
critical ways and a lot of really

752
00:30:46,130 --> 00:30:43,440
essential ways

753
00:30:47,690 --> 00:30:46,140
sorry I got completely distracted uh

754
00:30:51,769 --> 00:30:47,700
Carlos dangerous is asking where I was

755
00:30:54,529 --> 00:30:51,779
feeding um big bag of jelly beans oh my

756
00:30:55,909 --> 00:30:54,539
god dude I

757
00:30:58,909 --> 00:30:55,919
knit curiously through all of your

758
00:31:01,010 --> 00:30:58,919
habits I I get to I get to God you make

759
00:31:03,110 --> 00:31:01,020
me miss having a smoke uh I haven't had

760
00:31:05,450 --> 00:31:03,120
one of those in about 15 years oh man

761
00:31:08,269 --> 00:31:05,460
regular soda I haven't had a regular

762
00:31:10,310 --> 00:31:08,279
soda probably in about 15 years oh yeah

763
00:31:15,610 --> 00:31:10,320
I got a bag of jelly beans a Pepsi and a

764
00:31:21,409 --> 00:31:19,130
uh oh we were talking I just um you know

765
00:31:24,289 --> 00:31:21,419
you hear a lot of the UFO enthusiasts

766
00:31:26,090 --> 00:31:24,299
who I think um I can vaguely say do you

767
00:31:29,750 --> 00:31:26,100
subscribe to

768
00:31:31,490 --> 00:31:29,760
um a nhi flavored

769
00:31:32,690 --> 00:31:31,500
um proclivity right

770
00:31:35,690 --> 00:31:32,700
mm-hmm

771
00:31:37,250 --> 00:31:35,700
they all want uh science to take it

772
00:31:40,010 --> 00:31:37,260
seriously right but what do you give a

773
00:31:42,350 --> 00:31:40,020
scientist that is suggestive of any kind

774
00:31:44,690 --> 00:31:42,360
of nhi like do you give them a handful

775
00:31:46,190 --> 00:31:44,700
of cases and if so which ones

776
00:31:47,269 --> 00:31:46,200
um you know what I mean because what are

777
00:31:49,970 --> 00:31:47,279
they going to work with you give them

778
00:31:51,769 --> 00:31:49,980
this idea that's essentially just some a

779
00:31:54,289 --> 00:31:51,779
story we've all grown up with our entire

780
00:31:56,810 --> 00:31:54,299
lives like if you ask any kid in the

781
00:31:58,549 --> 00:31:56,820
states on the street what a UFO is and

782
00:32:00,649 --> 00:31:58,559
they'll draw you a flying saucer like

783
00:32:01,850 --> 00:32:00,659
like you said they are just completely

784
00:32:04,970 --> 00:32:01,860
linked

785
00:32:06,590 --> 00:32:04,980
why why are we and like we're really

786
00:32:07,669 --> 00:32:06,600
aware of that right like it's been

787
00:32:10,070 --> 00:32:07,679
around forever

788
00:32:13,549 --> 00:32:10,080
it's been about 80 years we don't have

789
00:32:15,769 --> 00:32:13,559
anything substantive to link to this

790
00:32:18,889 --> 00:32:15,779
idea why are we continuing with it what

791
00:32:21,649 --> 00:32:18,899
about this idea too though that this

792
00:32:24,529 --> 00:32:21,659
um let's say this phenomenon not in the

793
00:32:27,110 --> 00:32:24,539
capital T capital P the ufology but like

794
00:32:28,070 --> 00:32:27,120
this phenomenon itself is

795
00:32:30,169 --> 00:32:28,080
um

796
00:32:32,210 --> 00:32:30,179
does not fit within our current

797
00:32:35,149 --> 00:32:32,220
interpretive Frameworks for how we

798
00:32:36,769 --> 00:32:35,159
assess and measure and understand things

799
00:32:38,930 --> 00:32:36,779
around us this is what I keep coming

800
00:32:40,070 --> 00:32:38,940
back to like if I'm pushed against the

801
00:32:41,630 --> 00:32:40,080
wall

802
00:32:43,310 --> 00:32:41,640
um it had to give like my opinion or

803
00:32:47,570 --> 00:32:43,320
belief on this stuff I would say that

804
00:32:50,450 --> 00:32:47,580
sort of the the scientific method

805
00:32:52,669 --> 00:32:50,460
is very good for some things but very

806
00:32:56,810 --> 00:32:52,679
limited for other things

807
00:33:00,110 --> 00:32:56,820
um and that to presuppose that

808
00:33:05,090 --> 00:33:00,120
science as we currently understand it is

809
00:33:07,430 --> 00:33:05,100
a useful way to measure and verify this

810
00:33:09,590 --> 00:33:07,440
stuff to me feels like a long bow to

811
00:33:11,090 --> 00:33:09,600
draw like I'm not sure like I don't

812
00:33:13,190 --> 00:33:11,100
think it's well suited for that I also

813
00:33:14,870 --> 00:33:13,200
did before we keep going we have J shank

814
00:33:16,730 --> 00:33:14,880
backstage and I would love to have him

815
00:33:18,409 --> 00:33:16,740
on because yeah one is one of my

816
00:33:19,730 --> 00:33:18,419
favorite people and also I'm sure he has

817
00:33:21,110 --> 00:33:19,740
a whole lot to say about this so I'm

818
00:33:24,950 --> 00:33:21,120
gonna bring him on

819
00:33:27,649 --> 00:33:24,960
hey Jay hey guys I am a camera off

820
00:33:31,490 --> 00:33:27,659
because I'm really in a major trash

821
00:33:33,590 --> 00:33:31,500
Goblin state after being I have like a

822
00:33:38,269 --> 00:33:33,600
cold for three weeks and then just I'm

823
00:33:42,830 --> 00:33:38,279
back but uh can I believe in UFOs

824
00:33:45,830 --> 00:33:42,840
without believing the kind of

825
00:33:48,950 --> 00:33:45,840
dominant narrative that goes along with

826
00:33:52,669 --> 00:33:48,960
these hearings what do you mean by UFOs

827
00:33:54,169 --> 00:33:52,679
okay well like let's say they're like I

828
00:33:55,669 --> 00:33:54,179
still come back one of the reasons I

829
00:33:58,250 --> 00:33:55,679
don't abandon this is the fact that

830
00:33:59,750 --> 00:33:58,260
people keep seeing stuff people keep

831
00:34:03,110 --> 00:33:59,760
reporting stuff people keep having

832
00:34:04,970 --> 00:34:03,120
experiences but what I really don't like

833
00:34:06,769 --> 00:34:04,980
what I really have an issue with kind of

834
00:34:10,490 --> 00:34:06,779
with the hearing thing is first of all

835
00:34:12,409 --> 00:34:10,500
we're still in this like

836
00:34:17,210 --> 00:34:12,419
for lack of a better way to put it we're

837
00:34:20,089 --> 00:34:17,220
in the 80s 90s Mythos that came from

838
00:34:22,070 --> 00:34:20,099
really and this this what I'm about to

839
00:34:23,629 --> 00:34:22,080
say comes from research done and

840
00:34:27,169 --> 00:34:23,639
trickster in the Paranormal which I'm

841
00:34:31,550 --> 00:34:27,179
still reading through but a lot of CIA

842
00:34:34,010 --> 00:34:31,560
lint sources kind of feeding into the

843
00:34:36,829 --> 00:34:34,020
this this stuff with

844
00:34:38,629 --> 00:34:36,839
the abductions the alien human hybrids I

845
00:34:42,109 --> 00:34:38,639
know somebody said Lou is talking about

846
00:34:45,649 --> 00:34:42,119
uh psychic super soldiers the other day

847
00:34:46,609 --> 00:34:45,659
and we're in the we're

848
00:34:49,730 --> 00:34:46,619
the

849
00:34:52,849 --> 00:34:49,740
I'm gonna say I actually tonight right

850
00:34:55,070 --> 00:34:52,859
now at 9 36 on the East Coast I think

851
00:34:57,410 --> 00:34:55,080
that is a hundred percent

852
00:35:01,790 --> 00:35:00,050
something that the CIA in the Air Force

853
00:35:02,870 --> 00:35:01,800
intelligence made up because they don't

854
00:35:05,750 --> 00:35:02,880
know

855
00:35:09,230 --> 00:35:05,760
on the supernatural end of it and on the

856
00:35:12,050 --> 00:35:09,240
other end somehow like

857
00:35:13,670 --> 00:35:12,060
I'm gonna send Tom the log if I can get

858
00:35:16,810 --> 00:35:13,680
his anybody has Tom delong's home

859
00:35:22,250 --> 00:35:16,820
address I'm going to send him all of my

860
00:35:24,950 --> 00:35:22,260
childhood nerd books about the SR-71 and

861
00:35:27,109 --> 00:35:24,960
the F-117 and and

862
00:35:30,530 --> 00:35:27,119
um Black Ops

863
00:35:33,170 --> 00:35:30,540
black budget aircraft program so Tom can

864
00:35:35,150 --> 00:35:33,180
know that one of the things they

865
00:35:37,550 --> 00:35:35,160
engineered a lot of those things were to

866
00:35:38,690 --> 00:35:37,560
do was not display a real heavy thermal

867
00:35:40,910 --> 00:35:38,700
signature

868
00:35:42,290 --> 00:35:40,920
I I just

869
00:35:43,910 --> 00:35:42,300
um

870
00:35:46,970 --> 00:35:43,920
I just feel like

871
00:35:49,250 --> 00:35:46,980
the guys like the guys on Twitter like

872
00:35:50,089 --> 00:35:49,260
UFO Twitter

873
00:35:52,550 --> 00:35:50,099
um

874
00:35:54,470 --> 00:35:52,560
is not intellectually up to this there's

875
00:35:58,250 --> 00:35:54,480
like 50 books they need to read first

876
00:36:00,349 --> 00:35:58,260
just to get on the ground the ground

877
00:36:04,010 --> 00:36:00,359
floor of it but it's like it's

878
00:36:06,170 --> 00:36:04,020
exhausting like I am like I am watching

879
00:36:08,829 --> 00:36:06,180
the feed today and like my soul is

880
00:36:14,329 --> 00:36:08,839
slipping out of my ass

881
00:36:16,849 --> 00:36:14,339
just like yeah you know just like um

882
00:36:21,770 --> 00:36:16,859
somehow I was picturing like I'm trying

883
00:36:25,910 --> 00:36:21,780
to um psychically project myself forward

884
00:36:29,450 --> 00:36:25,920
in time where somebody is doing the like

885
00:36:32,750 --> 00:36:29,460
remember Louis eldizando like just like

886
00:36:34,310 --> 00:36:32,760
just like Corbell did with

887
00:36:36,650 --> 00:36:34,320
um

888
00:36:38,870 --> 00:36:36,660
you know what's his ass smile that's

889
00:36:41,870 --> 00:36:38,880
like I said the brain is dying right now

890
00:36:43,190 --> 00:36:41,880
they're um they're beaming the knowledge

891
00:36:45,470 --> 00:36:43,200
out of my head

892
00:36:47,030 --> 00:36:45,480
yeah Lazar you know it's just like it's

893
00:36:49,609 --> 00:36:47,040
the same [\h__\h]

894
00:36:51,410 --> 00:36:49,619
yeah and I honestly think this is

895
00:36:54,650 --> 00:36:51,420
holding us back from figuring anything

896
00:36:56,210 --> 00:36:54,660
out it's like there's a there's a giant

897
00:36:58,550 --> 00:36:56,220
um yes

898
00:37:00,230 --> 00:36:58,560
it's like when I look at the the look at

899
00:37:02,450 --> 00:37:00,240
the pie chart I'm like you know I bet

900
00:37:08,230 --> 00:37:02,460
those round ones that look like balloons

901
00:37:13,730 --> 00:37:10,970
do you agree with Jack Brewer when he

902
00:37:16,670 --> 00:37:13,740
says the stigma is earned

903
00:37:19,670 --> 00:37:16,680
um yeah I do I like Jack a lot

904
00:37:22,430 --> 00:37:19,680
um I think

905
00:37:25,430 --> 00:37:22,440
for some reason in this

906
00:37:27,170 --> 00:37:25,440
um taking its taking it seriously ends

907
00:37:29,750 --> 00:37:27,180
up being kind of a death sentence for

908
00:37:31,849 --> 00:37:29,760
you and uh

909
00:37:34,730 --> 00:37:31,859
doing like

910
00:37:37,910 --> 00:37:34,740
the Kearney Sideshow route ends up being

911
00:37:41,210 --> 00:37:37,920
I mean again I will say that being like

912
00:37:43,190 --> 00:37:41,220
big in the UFO world is a dubious Mark

913
00:37:46,430 --> 00:37:43,200
of Distinction

914
00:37:48,470 --> 00:37:46,440
you know it's a real

915
00:37:50,870 --> 00:37:48,480
um if I was like the world's most famous

916
00:37:52,510 --> 00:37:50,880
ufologist it's like being the world's

917
00:37:55,970 --> 00:37:52,520
tallest [\h__\h]

918
00:38:00,050 --> 00:37:55,980
you know it's just a real

919
00:38:02,150 --> 00:38:00,060
um thing but there's uh

920
00:38:04,849 --> 00:38:02,160
there's a lot of stuff on the popular

921
00:38:10,010 --> 00:38:04,859
end of it that

922
00:38:12,890 --> 00:38:10,020
I almost feel is well the the Deep the

923
00:38:14,870 --> 00:38:12,900
deeply con now the new newly formed

924
00:38:16,670 --> 00:38:14,880
um because I'm sort of uh coming out of

925
00:38:19,370 --> 00:38:16,680
my column sort of black pilled and

926
00:38:21,430 --> 00:38:19,380
reading um reading trickster paranormal

927
00:38:24,589 --> 00:38:21,440
there's a there's a major

928
00:38:26,589 --> 00:38:24,599
throughout that book that the the

929
00:38:28,790 --> 00:38:26,599
rational

930
00:38:31,490 --> 00:38:28,800
protects us from the dangerous

931
00:38:33,130 --> 00:38:31,500
manifestation of the supernatural the

932
00:38:36,430 --> 00:38:33,140
supernatural

933
00:38:39,230 --> 00:38:36,440
erupts from ambiguity

934
00:38:40,250 --> 00:38:39,240
considering the this phenomenon because

935
00:38:43,550 --> 00:38:40,260
it would have been considered

936
00:38:46,130 --> 00:38:43,560
Supernatural pre-1906.

937
00:38:49,250 --> 00:38:46,140
talking you know seeing stuff flying in

938
00:38:51,829 --> 00:38:49,260
the sky free it being like

939
00:38:55,490 --> 00:38:51,839
um the Germans in the Airship flying

940
00:38:58,010 --> 00:38:55,500
over England like what happens in 1906

941
00:38:59,930 --> 00:38:58,020
is it the zeppelins there's a lot I

942
00:39:02,089 --> 00:38:59,940
actually do have

943
00:39:05,270 --> 00:39:02,099
um I picked up a book about I love that

944
00:39:06,890 --> 00:39:05,280
stuff like I love the Airship sightings

945
00:39:09,770 --> 00:39:06,900
um I don't know why I picked this book

946
00:39:12,109 --> 00:39:09,780
up just because it has it's basically

947
00:39:14,329 --> 00:39:12,119
um it's the Red Baron in his focker

948
00:39:17,690 --> 00:39:14,339
tri-plane like it looks like he's like

949
00:39:21,410 --> 00:39:17,700
like pulling up and about to engage a

950
00:39:24,170 --> 00:39:21,420
atomancy type saucer is the Red Baron

951
00:39:26,690 --> 00:39:24,180
what's that I said is it Snoopy as the

952
00:39:28,730 --> 00:39:26,700
Red Baron no it's like my it's Montford

953
00:39:30,710 --> 00:39:28,740
Von Richtofen it's the Red Baron like

954
00:39:34,010 --> 00:39:30,720
all those Snoopy um

955
00:39:36,650 --> 00:39:34,020
Snoopy is also good but I'm like no I

956
00:39:38,450 --> 00:39:36,660
would watch that movie if it was

957
00:39:41,329 --> 00:39:38,460
um they would try to if they would try

958
00:39:44,210 --> 00:39:41,339
another uh like an iron Skies prequel or

959
00:39:46,130 --> 00:39:44,220
something but there's a level of me that

960
00:39:48,349 --> 00:39:46,140
actually does think that this sort of

961
00:39:52,130 --> 00:39:48,359
exists in place to keep us from

962
00:39:54,650 --> 00:39:52,140
confronting the truth that oh there's

963
00:39:58,069 --> 00:39:54,660
two bad truths the truth is that

964
00:40:00,950 --> 00:39:58,079
um in the last like post-cold War era

965
00:40:04,550 --> 00:40:00,960
yeah a lot of our our competitor Nations

966
00:40:06,589 --> 00:40:04,560
have caught up with us and can pull off

967
00:40:09,290 --> 00:40:06,599
some of the stuff that we could do in

968
00:40:12,770 --> 00:40:09,300
the 60s with uh weird hypersonics and

969
00:40:15,109 --> 00:40:12,780
stuff and there's also like the uh

970
00:40:21,609 --> 00:40:15,119
verbal Supernatural truth that no one

971
00:40:25,849 --> 00:40:23,930
NJ do you think

972
00:40:27,890 --> 00:40:25,859
um do you think genuinely that the

973
00:40:30,230 --> 00:40:27,900
government uh the way that they present

974
00:40:32,690 --> 00:40:30,240
this uh saying sort of like you know

975
00:40:35,390 --> 00:40:32,700
we're um on the same page as you guys

976
00:40:37,609 --> 00:40:35,400
and we're just getting NASA to take a

977
00:40:40,250 --> 00:40:37,619
look now to start with and uh we'll see

978
00:40:42,710 --> 00:40:40,260
what they have to say do you think um

979
00:40:44,690 --> 00:40:42,720
you think that's genuine uh or do you

980
00:40:45,970 --> 00:40:44,700
think that there is an underlying uh

981
00:40:48,710 --> 00:40:45,980
knowledge there

982
00:40:52,310 --> 00:40:48,720
I think that there's

983
00:40:55,550 --> 00:40:52,320
an underlying knowledge of adversary

984
00:40:58,550 --> 00:40:55,560
Nations operating in our airspace or

985
00:41:00,710 --> 00:40:58,560
that again because this stuff was so

986
00:41:04,250 --> 00:41:00,720
highly compartmentalized like we could

987
00:41:06,829 --> 00:41:04,260
be testing things that

988
00:41:10,370 --> 00:41:06,839
you know Christian Jello brand is not up

989
00:41:13,010 --> 00:41:10,380
on all the stuff like the average USAF

990
00:41:15,710 --> 00:41:13,020
even like the Interceptor pilot being

991
00:41:18,890 --> 00:41:15,720
scrambled to intercept a balloon is not

992
00:41:22,069 --> 00:41:18,900
like he does not know every single

993
00:41:24,650 --> 00:41:22,079
aircraft drone system weapon system that

994
00:41:27,170 --> 00:41:24,660
is in our inventory so I think it's a

995
00:41:29,930 --> 00:41:27,180
little of both like I think they they

996
00:41:32,329 --> 00:41:29,940
know some stuff and this is kind of it's

997
00:41:34,490 --> 00:41:32,339
a very reasonable approach

998
00:41:36,230 --> 00:41:34,500
and because it's reasonable it's kind of

999
00:41:39,050 --> 00:41:36,240
a calming thing it's like yeah there's

1000
00:41:39,710 --> 00:41:39,060
some stuff we don't know

1001
00:41:41,569 --> 00:41:39,720
um

1002
00:41:44,810 --> 00:41:41,579
and I think that's good enough for most

1003
00:41:50,210 --> 00:41:47,870
I got distracted by a comment

1004
00:41:52,310 --> 00:41:50,220
um Brooke 2 himself says we have

1005
00:41:54,650 --> 00:41:52,320
definitive statistical proof of

1006
00:41:56,270 --> 00:41:54,660
telepathy and even information picked up

1007
00:41:57,710 --> 00:41:56,280
via mediums and remote viewing and yet

1008
00:42:00,410 --> 00:41:57,720
that also has a stigma and is rejected

1009
00:42:01,910 --> 00:42:00,420
by mainstream uh sorry you're wrong

1010
00:42:04,010 --> 00:42:01,920
what

1011
00:42:06,589 --> 00:42:04,020
I'm not aware of any uh definitive

1012
00:42:10,010 --> 00:42:06,599
statistical proof of telepathy or uh

1013
00:42:11,329 --> 00:42:10,020
remote viewing yeah that exists I would

1014
00:42:14,270 --> 00:42:11,339
really like to hear about that though if

1015
00:42:15,950 --> 00:42:14,280
you want to I mean it is genuinely like

1016
00:42:18,829 --> 00:42:15,960
I would tell you

1017
00:42:21,829 --> 00:42:18,839
um check out the easy access book is

1018
00:42:25,150 --> 00:42:21,839
check out um Dean Raiden's book

1019
00:42:29,870 --> 00:42:28,010
Raiden talks about that here's what I

1020
00:42:32,750 --> 00:42:29,880
would say about this the statistical

1021
00:42:33,589 --> 00:42:32,760
proof is sort of

1022
00:42:36,109 --> 00:42:33,599
um

1023
00:42:38,390 --> 00:42:36,119
it is that it is a statistical proof

1024
00:42:41,569 --> 00:42:38,400
nobody I think two things have happened

1025
00:42:43,250 --> 00:42:41,579
with this first of all again

1026
00:42:45,230 --> 00:42:43,260
tricks are in the Paranormal really

1027
00:42:48,950 --> 00:42:45,240
talks about the stigma and this

1028
00:42:50,990 --> 00:42:48,960
rejection like the re the rejection of

1029
00:42:54,650 --> 00:42:51,000
um the Paranormal from a sociological

1030
00:42:56,329 --> 00:42:54,660
standpoint as societies move from being

1031
00:42:58,089 --> 00:42:56,339
governed by like an individual

1032
00:43:02,390 --> 00:42:58,099
charismatic

1033
00:43:04,190 --> 00:43:02,400
leader to a um govern kind of what we

1034
00:43:06,829 --> 00:43:04,200
have now with the bureaucratic structure

1035
00:43:08,870 --> 00:43:06,839
and thoughts of the supernatural have to

1036
00:43:11,930 --> 00:43:08,880
be discarded

1037
00:43:13,910 --> 00:43:11,940
until hip is a state where you have like

1038
00:43:16,790 --> 00:43:13,920
a regular kind of normal bureaucratic

1039
00:43:17,930 --> 00:43:16,800
Society the other thing is um and I hate

1040
00:43:21,010 --> 00:43:17,940
to say this because I think it's

1041
00:43:24,530 --> 00:43:21,020
fascinating it's not good for anything

1042
00:43:28,010 --> 00:43:24,540
like nobody has been able to take the

1043
00:43:32,690 --> 00:43:28,020
fact that there is a statistical

1044
00:43:34,809 --> 00:43:32,700
proof of telepathy and be like you can

1045
00:43:38,150 --> 00:43:34,819
train for telepathy we are we are

1046
00:43:41,270 --> 00:43:38,160
replicable the the problem the problem

1047
00:43:42,950 --> 00:43:41,280
with a lot of and this is again goes to

1048
00:43:44,510 --> 00:43:42,960
stuff that Hanson documents and

1049
00:43:48,730 --> 00:43:44,520
trickster is

1050
00:43:51,950 --> 00:43:48,740
there's a degree of social structure

1051
00:43:53,870 --> 00:43:51,960
that is more allowable in in the

1052
00:43:56,870 --> 00:43:53,880
Paranormal it seems that the trickster

1053
00:44:01,130 --> 00:43:56,880
element is that it seems to elude being

1054
00:44:04,450 --> 00:44:01,140
turned into a scientifically replicable

1055
00:44:07,609 --> 00:44:04,460
and repeatable process

1056
00:44:09,410 --> 00:44:07,619
and I think that's

1057
00:44:10,490 --> 00:44:09,420
some extent

1058
00:44:14,390 --> 00:44:10,500
um

1059
00:44:19,730 --> 00:44:14,400
that's why it just doesn't go anywhere

1060
00:44:23,390 --> 00:44:21,109
I wanted to lose their

1061
00:44:26,630 --> 00:44:23,400
X over my tea and had to like rush

1062
00:44:28,250 --> 00:44:26,640
around and clean up but um I know I'm a

1063
00:44:30,349 --> 00:44:28,260
hot mess tonight

1064
00:44:32,030 --> 00:44:30,359
um Jay I think of the question that you

1065
00:44:33,470 --> 00:44:32,040
sent me when I was speaking with Dr Jeff

1066
00:44:35,809 --> 00:44:33,480
[\h__\h]

1067
00:44:37,490 --> 00:44:35,819
um around uh in the trickster in the

1068
00:44:38,990 --> 00:44:37,500
Paranormal I'm just going to read it in

1069
00:44:41,270 --> 00:44:39,000
the trickster in the Paranormal Gregory

1070
00:44:43,550 --> 00:44:41,280
Hansen's analysis about anti-structure

1071
00:44:47,210 --> 00:44:43,560
argues that societies move towards not

1072
00:44:48,890 --> 00:44:47,220
having room for spiritual experience and

1073
00:44:52,130 --> 00:44:48,900
that also came to mind sort of in this

1074
00:44:53,990 --> 00:44:52,140
conversation this idea that like

1075
00:44:56,569 --> 00:44:54,000
um

1076
00:44:58,670 --> 00:44:56,579
we are increasingly moving towards a

1077
00:45:02,210 --> 00:44:58,680
human experience that does not have the

1078
00:45:03,890 --> 00:45:02,220
space for uh the mysterious right not

1079
00:45:06,829 --> 00:45:03,900
necessarily even the spiritual but that

1080
00:45:08,870 --> 00:45:06,839
it's sort of closing in on any of these

1081
00:45:10,250 --> 00:45:08,880
mysterious or numinous experiences that

1082
00:45:16,390 --> 00:45:10,260
have otherwise you know been pretty

1083
00:45:22,970 --> 00:45:19,849
that's that's a large part uh documented

1084
00:45:25,670 --> 00:45:22,980
part of his research that he he views

1085
00:45:28,010 --> 00:45:25,680
that as part of the phenomena of

1086
00:45:30,170 --> 00:45:28,020
demystifying

1087
00:45:32,030 --> 00:45:30,180
Society so I

1088
00:45:34,790 --> 00:45:32,040
but he views it as sort of a natural

1089
00:45:37,550 --> 00:45:34,800
process as Society just advances to the

1090
00:45:39,829 --> 00:45:37,560
to being all right a larger like we have

1091
00:45:42,109 --> 00:45:39,839
to have rules you know and as that

1092
00:45:44,750 --> 00:45:42,119
bureaucratic Society goes forward I

1093
00:45:47,270 --> 00:45:44,760
think that's why you see responses like

1094
00:45:50,210 --> 00:45:47,280
NASA's response which is just like well

1095
00:45:50,990 --> 00:45:50,220
we're gonna check it out I think

1096
00:45:53,030 --> 00:45:51,000
um

1097
00:45:55,250 --> 00:45:53,040
either response this is a little bit of

1098
00:45:56,630 --> 00:45:55,260
a classic thing

1099
00:45:58,430 --> 00:45:56,640
um

1100
00:46:00,349 --> 00:45:58,440
you don't want to know that the Chinese

1101
00:46:02,030 --> 00:46:00,359
are peaking at you necessarily that

1102
00:46:05,150 --> 00:46:02,040
seems to really upset a lot of people

1103
00:46:07,910 --> 00:46:05,160
although you know

1104
00:46:09,890 --> 00:46:07,920
um I don't really know I life is now too

1105
00:46:12,230 --> 00:46:09,900
boring to really care about that too

1106
00:46:14,150 --> 00:46:12,240
much but uh or you don't want to you

1107
00:46:16,490 --> 00:46:14,160
don't want the the government can't tell

1108
00:46:19,490 --> 00:46:16,500
you they don't know what's going on like

1109
00:46:21,589 --> 00:46:19,500
totally like it's like we really don't

1110
00:46:23,390 --> 00:46:21,599
know like this defies a rational

1111
00:46:26,530 --> 00:46:23,400
explanation

1112
00:46:29,809 --> 00:46:26,540
right I would love to yeah

1113
00:46:31,670 --> 00:46:29,819
go ahead Campbell please yes sir like um

1114
00:46:34,849 --> 00:46:31,680
just from uh the previous thing I wanted

1115
00:46:36,829 --> 00:46:34,859
to comment comment on the uh statistical

1116
00:46:38,930 --> 00:46:36,839
um evidence for uh telepathy because

1117
00:46:41,809 --> 00:46:38,940
this is something I that quite

1118
00:46:44,750 --> 00:46:41,819
interesting I saw a tweet by uh one of

1119
00:46:46,250 --> 00:46:44,760
the spokespeople for the CIA uh database

1120
00:46:47,750 --> 00:46:46,260
at one point it was like several months

1121
00:46:49,069 --> 00:46:47,760
ago and they were sort of promoting the

1122
00:46:51,230 --> 00:46:49,079
fact that they put a bunch of documents

1123
00:46:54,349 --> 00:46:51,240
on there and they uh included reference

1124
00:46:56,390 --> 00:46:54,359
to the CIA report that found uh oh you

1125
00:46:59,750 --> 00:46:56,400
know every time we do a psychic study we

1126
00:47:02,630 --> 00:46:59,760
find a um a statistical uh percentage a

1127
00:47:05,089 --> 00:47:02,640
few percentage points that defy

1128
00:47:07,849 --> 00:47:05,099
um you know uh an explanation other than

1129
00:47:09,589 --> 00:47:07,859
some kind of effect uh however we can't

1130
00:47:11,990 --> 00:47:09,599
um weapon not we can't figure out how to

1131
00:47:13,609 --> 00:47:12,000
weaponize it effectively uh when I saw

1132
00:47:16,609 --> 00:47:13,619
that I was like well that's interesting

1133
00:47:18,230 --> 00:47:16,619
I assume that um you know if there was a

1134
00:47:20,270 --> 00:47:18,240
verifiable effect it would be looked at

1135
00:47:22,550 --> 00:47:20,280
in the public realm and of course it has

1136
00:47:24,829 --> 00:47:22,560
been there have been actually several

1137
00:47:26,990 --> 00:47:24,839
like there were like a dozen studies uh

1138
00:47:29,930 --> 00:47:27,000
that uh replicated that effect over and

1139
00:47:31,430 --> 00:47:29,940
over again in the 2000s um the

1140
00:47:32,450 --> 00:47:31,440
researcher's name is eluding me right

1141
00:47:34,670 --> 00:47:32,460
now but

1142
00:47:37,069 --> 00:47:34,680
the most interesting part here is that

1143
00:47:38,569 --> 00:47:37,079
uh in the you know the scientific

1144
00:47:40,430 --> 00:47:38,579
Community they haven't accepted that

1145
00:47:43,130 --> 00:47:40,440
telepathy exists what has happened is

1146
00:47:44,829 --> 00:47:43,140
that dozens upon dozens of peer-reviewed

1147
00:47:49,069 --> 00:47:44,839
papers have been published in response

1148
00:47:51,589 --> 00:47:49,079
describing how a tiny effect can be

1149
00:47:54,589 --> 00:47:51,599
produced consistently that is not

1150
00:47:56,030 --> 00:47:54,599
produced in the actual study itself in

1151
00:47:58,490 --> 00:47:56,040
the social sciences and it's actually

1152
00:48:01,670 --> 00:47:58,500
led to a huge amount of focused

1153
00:48:03,290 --> 00:48:01,680
attention on how to try to look back on

1154
00:48:06,890 --> 00:48:03,300
the history of social sciences and

1155
00:48:09,109 --> 00:48:06,900
correct for the fact that uh studies in

1156
00:48:10,730 --> 00:48:09,119
that field can produce an effect that

1157
00:48:12,890 --> 00:48:10,740
does not appear to actually be

1158
00:48:16,550 --> 00:48:12,900
fundamentally real now that doesn't mean

1159
00:48:18,589 --> 00:48:16,560
that that's true but that is uh the way

1160
00:48:20,690 --> 00:48:18,599
that the field has interpreted those

1161
00:48:22,490 --> 00:48:20,700
results so I just wanted to clarify that

1162
00:48:24,190 --> 00:48:22,500
for any uh scientists listening in and

1163
00:48:26,450 --> 00:48:24,200
pulling out their hair

1164
00:48:28,190 --> 00:48:26,460
yeah it's kind of interesting one of the

1165
00:48:30,589 --> 00:48:28,200
comments was Dean radin has multiple

1166
00:48:33,109 --> 00:48:30,599
meta studies attention affects about

1167
00:48:34,550 --> 00:48:33,119
three percent on dice now how are you

1168
00:48:35,930 --> 00:48:34,560
determining the causal relationship

1169
00:48:38,270 --> 00:48:35,940
between whatever these people are

1170
00:48:40,550 --> 00:48:38,280
claiming they're doing and the dice

1171
00:48:42,170 --> 00:48:40,560
um how do you know and this is this is a

1172
00:48:45,250 --> 00:48:42,180
joke but how do you know like a

1173
00:48:47,870 --> 00:48:45,260
poltergeist is an invisible Poltergeist

1174
00:48:49,970 --> 00:48:47,880
affecting the Dyson rather than the test

1175
00:48:52,069 --> 00:48:49,980
subject things like that I'd like to I'd

1176
00:48:54,770 --> 00:48:52,079
really like to see all these studies and

1177
00:48:56,750 --> 00:48:54,780
it sounds like to himself he knows about

1178
00:48:59,329 --> 00:48:56,760
a lot of them so if you want to um

1179
00:49:00,650 --> 00:48:59,339
hit me up after the show or like uh link

1180
00:49:01,849 --> 00:49:00,660
some of these things because I'm super

1181
00:49:04,010 --> 00:49:01,859
interested yeah this is super

1182
00:49:05,569 --> 00:49:04,020
fascinating I spent I spent a lot of

1183
00:49:07,970 --> 00:49:05,579
time digging through a lot of the global

1184
00:49:10,030 --> 00:49:07,980
consciousness studies as well which were

1185
00:49:15,230 --> 00:49:10,040
out of the Princeton the pear

1186
00:49:18,530 --> 00:49:17,450
um and have some you know look

1187
00:49:20,589 --> 00:49:18,540
um

1188
00:49:23,150 --> 00:49:20,599
I I

1189
00:49:24,290 --> 00:49:23,160
have enough background in statistics I

1190
00:49:26,030 --> 00:49:24,300
spent some time with some of these

1191
00:49:28,130 --> 00:49:26,040
papers just kind of like pressure

1192
00:49:29,990 --> 00:49:28,140
testing their approaches and they seem

1193
00:49:31,970 --> 00:49:30,000
pretty interesting right like it seems

1194
00:49:34,010 --> 00:49:31,980
they seem interesting

1195
00:49:36,710 --> 00:49:34,020
um I don't know I don't feel comfortable

1196
00:49:38,390 --> 00:49:36,720
conferring oh yeah you know this is

1197
00:49:40,309 --> 00:49:38,400
definitely legit but it was interesting

1198
00:49:42,589 --> 00:49:40,319
enough to say it's worth exploring

1199
00:49:45,410 --> 00:49:42,599
further right just like I think the work

1200
00:49:47,390 --> 00:49:45,420
by Ryan at Duke is worth exploring

1201
00:49:50,150 --> 00:49:47,400
further I love all that stuff too yeah I

1202
00:49:51,470 --> 00:49:50,160
mean and don't I don't misunderstand

1203
00:49:53,030 --> 00:49:51,480
that I'm trying to say that I'm the

1204
00:49:55,490 --> 00:49:53,040
Arbiter whether or not these are

1205
00:49:57,109 --> 00:49:55,500
[\h__\h] or not I um I I am like

1206
00:49:58,670 --> 00:49:57,119
personally interested in them too so I

1207
00:50:00,410 --> 00:49:58,680
don't know if they didn't sound like I

1208
00:50:02,329 --> 00:50:00,420
was trying to like yeah put on you in

1209
00:50:03,770 --> 00:50:02,339
the chat or anything but a lot of the a

1210
00:50:05,510 --> 00:50:03,780
lot of the stuff that they've done with

1211
00:50:08,030 --> 00:50:05,520
the experiments was trying to figure out

1212
00:50:10,490 --> 00:50:08,040
who was doing what where like one of

1213
00:50:13,309 --> 00:50:10,500
them was was the actual like if I'm

1214
00:50:15,470 --> 00:50:13,319
conducting an experiment is it my

1215
00:50:17,990 --> 00:50:15,480
solubility affecting my students results

1216
00:50:22,250 --> 00:50:18,000
or my test subjects results you know not

1217
00:50:23,510 --> 00:50:22,260
my test subjects doing it but I again I

1218
00:50:26,510 --> 00:50:23,520
think it doesn't

1219
00:50:29,150 --> 00:50:26,520
um like Henry Rollins said gonna get me

1220
00:50:32,569 --> 00:50:29,160
laid can I sell it on eBay the answer to

1221
00:50:35,150 --> 00:50:32,579
both of those is no so it's not

1222
00:50:38,030 --> 00:50:35,160
um something that uh we're seeing like

1223
00:50:39,829 --> 00:50:38,040
you can't buy a Samsung product that can

1224
00:50:42,770 --> 00:50:39,839
we use it to bump around people that's

1225
00:50:44,329 --> 00:50:42,780
sort of thing right yeah and I want to

1226
00:50:46,790 --> 00:50:44,339
point out too like just to reiterate

1227
00:50:48,829 --> 00:50:46,800
that the CIA themselves in their

1228
00:50:50,990 --> 00:50:48,839
internal documents concluded that the

1229
00:50:52,849 --> 00:50:51,000
psychic phenomena was real

1230
00:50:54,530 --> 00:50:52,859
um and it was only uh you know decades

1231
00:50:55,849 --> 00:50:54,540
later in the public realm with the peer

1232
00:50:57,829 --> 00:50:55,859
review and then the other scientists

1233
00:51:00,049 --> 00:50:57,839
coming in and uh sort of being like well

1234
00:51:01,849 --> 00:51:00,059
I think it's this that that observation

1235
00:51:04,849 --> 00:51:01,859
that there's always this uh statistical

1236
00:51:06,349 --> 00:51:04,859
anomaly the interpretation being oh flaw

1237
00:51:08,210 --> 00:51:06,359
in the way that the studies have done or

1238
00:51:09,650 --> 00:51:08,220
any other uh you know actual psychic

1239
00:51:11,569 --> 00:51:09,660
phenomena or whatever so the observation

1240
00:51:13,970 --> 00:51:11,579
is a hundred percent the interpretation

1241
00:51:15,829 --> 00:51:13,980
is a you know reasonably subject to

1242
00:51:17,630 --> 00:51:15,839
debate

1243
00:51:20,390 --> 00:51:17,640
this reminds me something we talked

1244
00:51:23,329 --> 00:51:20,400
about maybe a couple months ago is uh

1245
00:51:25,490 --> 00:51:23,339
doing an on-air zener card test with uh

1246
00:51:27,349 --> 00:51:25,500
with all the uh the crew here and I

1247
00:51:29,150 --> 00:51:27,359
still want to do that at some point we

1248
00:51:31,010 --> 00:51:29,160
definitely should but I'm like I'm

1249
00:51:32,329 --> 00:51:31,020
really interested in zener cards um I

1250
00:51:34,130 --> 00:51:32,339
once did them on a first date with

1251
00:51:35,630 --> 00:51:34,140
someone and we just got drunker and

1252
00:51:37,250 --> 00:51:35,640
drunker over the course of the night and

1253
00:51:38,809 --> 00:51:37,260
played with the senior cards could you

1254
00:51:40,490 --> 00:51:38,819
explain what what are those actually

1255
00:51:43,670 --> 00:51:40,500
could you explain that to me one second

1256
00:51:45,410 --> 00:51:43,680
I'll go get them you have um but the

1257
00:51:46,730 --> 00:51:45,420
other circumstance where I think could

1258
00:51:48,950 --> 00:51:46,740
be fascinating is in any kind of

1259
00:51:50,270 --> 00:51:48,960
transpersonal situation situation like

1260
00:51:53,270 --> 00:51:50,280
whether it's a ketamine experience

1261
00:51:54,950 --> 00:51:53,280
psychedelic experience uh or holotropic

1262
00:51:57,290 --> 00:51:54,960
breath work or even social noting or

1263
00:51:58,849 --> 00:51:57,300
like group meditation I think like that

1264
00:52:01,069 --> 00:51:58,859
plus senior cards would be really

1265
00:52:02,809 --> 00:52:01,079
fascinating to dig into I think uh

1266
00:52:04,549 --> 00:52:02,819
liminal Earth is doing the Philip

1267
00:52:06,790 --> 00:52:04,559
experiment tonight too

1268
00:52:08,809 --> 00:52:06,800
on their live stream

1269
00:52:10,490 --> 00:52:08,819
talk about this because it's happening

1270
00:52:12,650 --> 00:52:10,500
at 11 o'clock right yeah it's happening

1271
00:52:14,450 --> 00:52:12,660
11 o'clock um liminal Earth are doing

1272
00:52:16,130 --> 00:52:14,460
the Philip experiment which if you're

1273
00:52:17,450 --> 00:52:16,140
not familiar with the Philip experiment

1274
00:52:19,430 --> 00:52:17,460
it was

1275
00:52:21,710 --> 00:52:19,440
basically we're going to will a ghost

1276
00:52:24,770 --> 00:52:21,720
into existence we're going to create a

1277
00:52:26,150 --> 00:52:24,780
personality and manifest it even though

1278
00:52:29,390 --> 00:52:26,160
it is not

1279
00:52:31,130 --> 00:52:29,400
um conforming to the at the Phillips

1280
00:52:32,990 --> 00:52:31,140
experience where it's a ghost and it's

1281
00:52:35,990 --> 00:52:33,000
not Conformity it's not conforming to

1282
00:52:38,210 --> 00:52:36,000
the some dead person

1283
00:52:39,589 --> 00:52:38,220
um we're just making we're you know kind

1284
00:52:41,329 --> 00:52:39,599
of like Twitter likes to make up a dude

1285
00:52:44,630 --> 00:52:41,339
to get mad at they're just making up a

1286
00:52:46,790 --> 00:52:44,640
dude and trying to talk to them

1287
00:52:48,349 --> 00:52:46,800
this is It's funny Brooke is commenting

1288
00:52:49,670 --> 00:52:48,359
on this too right now that's the case he

1289
00:52:51,290 --> 00:52:49,680
looked into contouring Philip they

1290
00:52:53,690 --> 00:52:51,300
created a fake person living in a castle

1291
00:52:55,069 --> 00:52:53,700
and conquered it using old school medium

1292
00:52:56,329 --> 00:52:55,079
techniques

1293
00:52:58,430 --> 00:52:56,339
I feel like

1294
00:53:00,470 --> 00:52:58,440
um Taps does that on TV a lot too it

1295
00:53:03,589 --> 00:53:00,480
seems the people at Skinwalker Ranch

1296
00:53:04,549 --> 00:53:03,599
one of the things on a lot of this stuff

1297
00:53:07,490 --> 00:53:04,559
um

1298
00:53:10,130 --> 00:53:07,500
I I kind of want I also feel like we

1299
00:53:11,809 --> 00:53:10,140
sort of need to disabuse the idea that

1300
00:53:14,150 --> 00:53:11,819
we're all rational and making rational

1301
00:53:15,950 --> 00:53:14,160
decisions on us and

1302
00:53:17,809 --> 00:53:15,960
like talking about things like why isn't

1303
00:53:19,910 --> 00:53:17,819
why isn't the PSI research more well

1304
00:53:24,109 --> 00:53:19,920
known people

1305
00:53:27,170 --> 00:53:24,119
um really seem to high belief to their

1306
00:53:28,250 --> 00:53:27,180
identity and I think you see that like

1307
00:53:30,290 --> 00:53:28,260
you have

1308
00:53:33,589 --> 00:53:30,300
um an absolute belief in rationalism

1309
00:53:35,809 --> 00:53:33,599
that lives in Academia back

1310
00:53:38,270 --> 00:53:35,819
you know I mean I don't even remember

1311
00:53:40,790 --> 00:53:38,280
just talking to a guy a friend of mine

1312
00:53:42,710 --> 00:53:40,800
who's a physics major and I was trying

1313
00:53:43,970 --> 00:53:42,720
you know anything out of this person I

1314
00:53:46,069 --> 00:53:43,980
was trying to get like well you can't

1315
00:53:48,049 --> 00:53:46,079
talk mathematically determine like what

1316
00:53:50,750 --> 00:53:48,059
the what the best song in the world is

1317
00:53:53,150 --> 00:53:50,760
and he was really like having like I I

1318
00:53:54,650 --> 00:53:53,160
like accidentally which I was just like

1319
00:53:56,990 --> 00:53:54,660
like you know it's like my [\h__\h] around

1320
00:53:58,990 --> 00:53:57,000
and accidentally do so spinological

1321
00:54:03,470 --> 00:53:59,000
crisis in your homeboy

1322
00:54:05,690 --> 00:54:03,480
no like there has to be and if there's

1323
00:54:10,430 --> 00:54:05,700
not none of this matters

1324
00:54:12,890 --> 00:54:10,440
when I'm like whoa but okay well um but

1325
00:54:14,510 --> 00:54:12,900
you but just again like I said on I

1326
00:54:18,609 --> 00:54:14,520
think the last time she was like on the

1327
00:54:23,470 --> 00:54:18,619
other hand Deeds are horny for UFOs like

1328
00:54:26,630 --> 00:54:23,480
DD The X-Files and Mythos to be real and

1329
00:54:28,130 --> 00:54:26,640
that whole like that whole thing needs

1330
00:54:32,329 --> 00:54:28,140
to be treated on because they really

1331
00:54:34,130 --> 00:54:32,339
suck a lot of who they are into that

1332
00:54:38,390 --> 00:54:34,140
yeah

1333
00:54:42,410 --> 00:54:38,400
of I just think it governs a lot of

1334
00:54:44,569 --> 00:54:42,420
decision making yes yes yes it does and

1335
00:54:47,210 --> 00:54:44,579
it also precludes

1336
00:54:49,790 --> 00:54:47,220
um to me like complex or nuanced

1337
00:54:51,410 --> 00:54:49,800
thinking around the subject right this

1338
00:54:53,630 --> 00:54:51,420
is this is you could basically talk

1339
00:54:55,010 --> 00:54:53,640
about the criticism of trained observers

1340
00:54:56,450 --> 00:54:55,020
that we opened the show with as an

1341
00:54:58,549 --> 00:54:56,460
example of this like any kind of

1342
00:55:01,010 --> 00:54:58,559
criticism or pushback on the fallibility

1343
00:55:03,349 --> 00:55:01,020
of human trained observers is frequently

1344
00:55:06,410 --> 00:55:03,359
transmuted into a direct personal attack

1345
00:55:09,890 --> 00:55:06,420
on UFOs uh

1346
00:55:12,170 --> 00:55:09,900
yeah I uh the treatment server thing is

1347
00:55:14,030 --> 00:55:12,180
interesting because I know

1348
00:55:16,430 --> 00:55:14,040
um the astonishing Legends podcast guys

1349
00:55:19,609 --> 00:55:16,440
listen to that a lot or they mention

1350
00:55:20,630 --> 00:55:19,619
that a lot and you know one of the

1351
00:55:22,970 --> 00:55:20,640
things

1352
00:55:28,010 --> 00:55:25,849
so you know I I former pilot I am

1353
00:55:31,370 --> 00:55:28,020
technically a trained Observer all

1354
00:55:33,829 --> 00:55:31,380
really I am trained for is to like see

1355
00:55:35,990 --> 00:55:33,839
stuff that is also in the sky and my

1356
00:55:38,930 --> 00:55:36,000
number one judgment is am I on a

1357
00:55:43,010 --> 00:55:38,940
collision course with an organized and

1358
00:55:45,349 --> 00:55:43,020
once like that's like a real binary you

1359
00:55:48,650 --> 00:55:45,359
just you know just like nope you're not

1360
00:55:50,210 --> 00:55:48,660
or yup we are and then like I and it's

1361
00:55:51,349 --> 00:55:50,220
like you either have to move or you

1362
00:55:53,270 --> 00:55:51,359
don't

1363
00:55:56,270 --> 00:55:53,280
um popular item you can get this you

1364
00:55:58,490 --> 00:55:56,280
ever go to the uh Air Force Museum in

1365
00:56:01,790 --> 00:55:58,500
Dayton Ohio which is highly worthwhile

1366
00:56:03,049 --> 00:56:01,800
because you can see a ton of X Planes up

1367
00:56:05,329 --> 00:56:03,059
close

1368
00:56:06,650 --> 00:56:05,339
um you can get aircraft identification

1369
00:56:10,490 --> 00:56:06,660
cards

1370
00:56:12,770 --> 00:56:10,500
um to identify what's what this is just

1371
00:56:15,109 --> 00:56:12,780
copy they introduce these in the second

1372
00:56:17,870 --> 00:56:15,119
world war at the top of playing cards

1373
00:56:20,690 --> 00:56:17,880
with the Silhouettes Of

1374
00:56:22,790 --> 00:56:20,700
Allied and adversary aircraft on them so

1375
00:56:25,309 --> 00:56:22,800
you can train yourself to quickly

1376
00:56:28,549 --> 00:56:25,319
identify that silhouette but that's

1377
00:56:31,010 --> 00:56:28,559
different like I mean I don't

1378
00:56:32,930 --> 00:56:31,020
you know it's like okay there's another

1379
00:56:35,210 --> 00:56:32,940
small plane in the air with me it's like

1380
00:56:38,690 --> 00:56:35,220
is that a beachcraft or Piper it's like

1381
00:56:41,630 --> 00:56:38,700
I don't know we're also both like flying

1382
00:56:44,329 --> 00:56:41,640
at 140 knots per hour so you know you

1383
00:56:46,430 --> 00:56:44,339
add that up or closure rates on each

1384
00:56:49,370 --> 00:56:46,440
other pretty fast and it's like I don't

1385
00:56:52,430 --> 00:56:49,380
know there's another low window next

1386
00:56:56,089 --> 00:56:52,440
year I don't know moving on

1387
00:56:57,470 --> 00:56:56,099
so I I I think a lot of the you're not

1388
00:56:59,690 --> 00:56:57,480
going to go back to this and I hate to

1389
00:57:01,670 --> 00:56:59,700
say this because um the real you know

1390
00:57:04,490 --> 00:57:01,680
guys is the real meta conspiracy behind

1391
00:57:06,770 --> 00:57:04,500
all of this somewhere is uh Publishers

1392
00:57:10,270 --> 00:57:06,780
and booksellers just get enough to buy

1393
00:57:14,270 --> 00:57:10,280
all this stuff to read but yeah

1394
00:57:16,870 --> 00:57:14,280
I I just um merch it's that's the real

1395
00:57:19,549 --> 00:57:16,880
conspiracy but uh I think if people

1396
00:57:21,410 --> 00:57:19,559
actually were diffused on a hostility if

1397
00:57:22,790 --> 00:57:21,420
they got into the granular details a

1398
00:57:25,790 --> 00:57:22,800
little bit like could just divorced

1399
00:57:27,829 --> 00:57:25,800
themselves from the UFOs because the

1400
00:57:31,450 --> 00:57:27,839
Mythos is fine but actually the details

1401
00:57:35,809 --> 00:57:34,010
so circling back Nick are you ready to

1402
00:57:39,650 --> 00:57:35,819
talk about zener cards I see you're

1403
00:57:40,730 --> 00:57:39,660
shuffling them oh yeah hey yeah yeah do

1404
00:57:41,930 --> 00:57:40,740
you know the uh do you know the five

1405
00:57:45,910 --> 00:57:41,940
shapes

1406
00:57:52,069 --> 00:57:45,920
I do not so I do oh I do positive lift

1407
00:57:55,250 --> 00:57:53,690
that square

1408
00:57:56,690 --> 00:57:55,260
star

1409
00:58:00,010 --> 00:57:56,700
Circle

1410
00:58:04,010 --> 00:58:00,020
uh uh plus sign

1411
00:58:06,710 --> 00:58:04,020
and the bacon one oh yeah those squiggle

1412
00:58:09,710 --> 00:58:06,720
lines the bacon Dr Peter Venkman says a

1413
00:58:11,690 --> 00:58:09,720
bunch of wavy lines most people know of

1414
00:58:13,069 --> 00:58:11,700
zener cards is from the uh from

1415
00:58:16,370 --> 00:58:13,079
Ghostbusters

1416
00:58:17,630 --> 00:58:16,380
but uh these were these were produced

1417
00:58:20,990 --> 00:58:17,640
back in Duke

1418
00:58:23,750 --> 00:58:21,000
um like do you name like Carl zeiner I

1419
00:58:25,910 --> 00:58:23,760
think for JB Ryan I believe

1420
00:58:28,069 --> 00:58:25,920
um actually the a lot of the studies

1421
00:58:30,650 --> 00:58:28,079
that were done using these it was found

1422
00:58:33,049 --> 00:58:30,660
out uh after the fact that the cards

1423
00:58:34,309 --> 00:58:33,059
were kind of translucent and a lot of

1424
00:58:35,809 --> 00:58:34,319
the subjects could see right through

1425
00:58:39,349 --> 00:58:35,819
them

1426
00:58:43,010 --> 00:58:41,690
for everybody getting a good psychic hit

1427
00:58:46,970 --> 00:58:43,020
on this

1428
00:58:55,789 --> 00:58:50,990
Leah I said star the star Campbell

1429
00:58:59,510 --> 00:58:55,799
I I feel Stars well Luis

1430
00:59:03,670 --> 00:59:01,130
circled

1431
00:59:07,270 --> 00:59:03,680
Luis is psychic

1432
00:59:13,010 --> 00:59:10,490
neither do I but I am interested in this

1433
00:59:14,630 --> 00:59:13,020
so yeah uh Brooke please

1434
00:59:16,549 --> 00:59:14,640
um hit me up somehow I'm not on Twitter

1435
00:59:18,109 --> 00:59:16,559
anymore first but uh what happened to

1436
00:59:22,069 --> 00:59:18,119
you on Twitter

1437
00:59:25,010 --> 00:59:22,079
dude I just I can't it's too stupid I

1438
00:59:28,670 --> 00:59:25,020
feel it I feel it it gets worse it gets

1439
00:59:31,130 --> 00:59:28,680
worse every day but I'm still um

1440
00:59:34,190 --> 00:59:31,140
you missed like I'm still hanging on

1441
00:59:37,250 --> 00:59:34,200
because like um Christian fascist Matt

1442
00:59:39,310 --> 00:59:37,260
Walsh's Twitter got hacked the other day

1443
00:59:40,990 --> 00:59:39,320
and it was like genuinely hilarious

1444
00:59:44,630 --> 00:59:41,000
[Laughter]

1445
00:59:47,569 --> 00:59:44,640
a fantastic terrorist and a problem

1446
00:59:49,849 --> 00:59:47,579
um but no I uh I I don't want to deny

1447
00:59:51,650 --> 00:59:49,859
that there was no value in UFO Twitter I

1448
00:59:53,450 --> 00:59:51,660
mean it's how I met a lot of you

1449
00:59:55,010 --> 00:59:53,460
um so how I made a lot of connections in

1450
00:59:57,230 --> 00:59:55,020
this field I like I know a ton of cool

1451
00:59:58,970 --> 00:59:57,240
people now because of it but

1452
01:00:00,950 --> 00:59:58,980
um I reached the

1453
01:00:03,410 --> 01:00:00,960
I reached the point where like I've met

1454
01:00:05,569 --> 01:00:03,420
everybody I'm going to meet see that uh

1455
01:00:06,950 --> 01:00:05,579
it's kind of filled its purpose so I'm

1456
01:00:09,410 --> 01:00:06,960
just I'm just kind of done with it right

1457
01:00:11,630 --> 01:00:09,420
now it the only purpose it served was to

1458
01:00:13,430 --> 01:00:11,640
get into fights which you know was fun

1459
01:00:15,950 --> 01:00:13,440
sometimes but uh

1460
01:00:18,049 --> 01:00:15,960
just I don't know it's it's too hard to

1461
01:00:21,289 --> 01:00:18,059
keep up with that in everything else

1462
01:00:23,390 --> 01:00:21,299
going on so I I had to bail weird

1463
01:00:25,309 --> 01:00:23,400
Twitter's Vibe is way better than UFO

1464
01:00:27,410 --> 01:00:25,319
Twitter I'm trying to slowly kind of

1465
01:00:29,270 --> 01:00:27,420
migrate into that space yeah that's like

1466
01:00:32,390 --> 01:00:29,280
where Jay's from that's where Vanessa's

1467
01:00:34,309 --> 01:00:32,400
from yeah I saw I saw because I follow

1468
01:00:35,450 --> 01:00:34,319
uh Jay it was probably one of my first

1469
01:00:36,890 --> 01:00:35,460
followers on Twitter a couple years

1470
01:00:38,930 --> 01:00:36,900
that's how I found Jay was through you

1471
01:00:40,970 --> 01:00:38,940
dude I saw you guys going back and forth

1472
01:00:43,789 --> 01:00:40,980
on memes and it was like this guy posts

1473
01:00:46,309 --> 01:00:43,799
a plus content so I wanted to kind of

1474
01:00:49,730 --> 01:00:46,319
like dip back into that kind of whole

1475
01:00:51,710 --> 01:00:49,740
paranormal stuff like less cfmr um you

1476
01:00:52,970 --> 01:00:51,720
know ESP stuff or even ghosts I still

1477
01:00:55,609 --> 01:00:52,980
love ghosts

1478
01:00:56,870 --> 01:00:55,619
um absolutely I just I don't know I

1479
01:00:58,430 --> 01:00:56,880
couldn't I couldn't kind of breach into

1480
01:00:59,650 --> 01:00:58,440
that Community maybe I'll try again

1481
01:01:02,329 --> 01:00:59,660
someday

1482
01:01:06,650 --> 01:01:02,339
we're having a we're having a picnic in

1483
01:01:08,630 --> 01:01:06,660
July that sounds nice yeah there are

1484
01:01:10,609 --> 01:01:08,640
nice people they're they're there are

1485
01:01:12,410 --> 01:01:10,619
some bad people there but it's kind of

1486
01:01:14,510 --> 01:01:12,420
like I feel like a lot of them either

1487
01:01:16,910 --> 01:01:14,520
quit or got pushed kind of pushing the

1488
01:01:18,470 --> 01:01:16,920
margins but uh

1489
01:01:21,049 --> 01:01:18,480
um I don't think

1490
01:01:23,690 --> 01:01:21,059
I think with UFO Twitter

1491
01:01:26,930 --> 01:01:23,700
um some people are like there's some

1492
01:01:30,410 --> 01:01:26,940
people that are um both like really uh

1493
01:01:32,150 --> 01:01:30,420
need a diagnosis who are alarming that

1494
01:01:34,870 --> 01:01:32,160
they're I think people do get sucked

1495
01:01:37,430 --> 01:01:34,880
into that like like

1496
01:01:40,490 --> 01:01:37,440
dudes that think they're um

1497
01:01:42,309 --> 01:01:40,500
secret agents or something it's a little

1498
01:01:46,490 --> 01:01:42,319
it's a little intense

1499
01:01:48,049 --> 01:01:46,500
yeah there's a lot of that Collective

1500
01:01:50,089 --> 01:01:48,059
um

1501
01:01:53,329 --> 01:01:50,099
I don't want to say Collective Mental

1502
01:01:55,609 --> 01:01:53,339
Illness but it's sort of like lots of

1503
01:01:57,589 --> 01:01:55,619
people with very bad ideas just kind of

1504
01:01:59,470 --> 01:01:57,599
huffing each other's farts to be

1505
01:02:02,870 --> 01:01:59,480
extremely crude

1506
01:02:04,910 --> 01:02:02,880
they do have a a form of hive mind and

1507
01:02:07,490 --> 01:02:04,920
that hive mind oh yeah I have a mental

1508
01:02:09,230 --> 01:02:07,500
illness yeah like it's foliated right

1509
01:02:12,349 --> 01:02:09,240
like it's sort of this like Collective

1510
01:02:15,049 --> 01:02:12,359
Madness or this Collective tilt

1511
01:02:18,530 --> 01:02:15,059
um that they tend like not only tend to

1512
01:02:21,650 --> 01:02:18,540
create and

1513
01:02:23,569 --> 01:02:21,660
um like churn constantly but also are

1514
01:02:25,250 --> 01:02:23,579
deeply deeply protective of again this

1515
01:02:28,430 --> 01:02:25,260
goes back to this idea of the egoic

1516
01:02:30,770 --> 01:02:28,440
identity being really tied up in UFOs

1517
01:02:32,630 --> 01:02:30,780
um where any kind of pushback or inquiry

1518
01:02:35,870 --> 01:02:32,640
or interrogation of their claims or

1519
01:02:38,030 --> 01:02:35,880
their behaviors is basically

1520
01:02:39,710 --> 01:02:38,040
um treated as a direct personal attack

1521
01:02:42,109 --> 01:02:39,720
whenever I witness this and of course

1522
01:02:44,750 --> 01:02:42,119
Twitter is UFO Twitter particularly is

1523
01:02:46,069 --> 01:02:44,760
Rife with it like I'm immediately always

1524
01:02:47,569 --> 01:02:46,079
curious about how these people actually

1525
01:02:49,250 --> 01:02:47,579
function in real life are they actually

1526
01:02:51,170 --> 01:02:49,260
this dysfunctional like how do they

1527
01:02:53,270 --> 01:02:51,180
maintain any sort of semblance of normal

1528
01:02:54,950 --> 01:02:53,280
human behavior whereas Twitter just

1529
01:02:57,230 --> 01:02:54,960
happens to be this Outlet where they get

1530
01:02:58,730 --> 01:02:57,240
to be completely crazy

1531
01:03:02,150 --> 01:02:58,740
I mean

1532
01:03:03,530 --> 01:03:02,160
personally yeah it is because you know

1533
01:03:05,809 --> 01:03:03,540
if

1534
01:03:09,190 --> 01:03:05,819
days that I'm frustrated I would vent on

1535
01:03:11,690 --> 01:03:09,200
Twitter I would I would pick UFO fights

1536
01:03:13,670 --> 01:03:11,700
literally just to vent just and I

1537
01:03:15,770 --> 01:03:13,680
enjoyed it and that's that's when you

1538
01:03:17,210 --> 01:03:15,780
said that though UFO fights I was

1539
01:03:18,650 --> 01:03:17,220
literally picturing some kind of

1540
01:03:20,990 --> 01:03:18,660
claymation

1541
01:03:24,470 --> 01:03:21,000
um show like MTV's old celebrity death

1542
01:03:27,230 --> 01:03:24,480
match where I would if they brought that

1543
01:03:29,510 --> 01:03:27,240
format back with UFO personalities I

1544
01:03:32,390 --> 01:03:29,520
would watch that

1545
01:03:32,400 --> 01:03:35,809
you know what

1546
01:03:39,589 --> 01:03:37,549
actually there's a dude on Twitter and I

1547
01:03:41,030 --> 01:03:39,599
the name is escaping me he's a he's a

1548
01:03:44,510 --> 01:03:41,040
big believer I think he's a big he's

1549
01:03:47,329 --> 01:03:44,520
like really into Lou but uh he's he

1550
01:03:49,010 --> 01:03:47,339
sculpted a sculpture of lewinudes it was

1551
01:03:50,569 --> 01:03:49,020
really good so like there's people with

1552
01:03:53,630 --> 01:03:50,579
Talent out there

1553
01:03:55,309 --> 01:03:53,640
Jay so I mean yeah I can't I wish I

1554
01:03:56,569 --> 01:03:55,319
could remember versus name I think they

1555
01:03:58,730 --> 01:03:56,579
have a YouTube channel too and they make

1556
01:04:00,650 --> 01:03:58,740
kind of like little uh UFO documentaries

1557
01:04:03,170 --> 01:04:00,660
and stuff the sculpting they're awesome

1558
01:04:05,210 --> 01:04:03,180
he uh process of how he made it and

1559
01:04:07,370 --> 01:04:05,220
stuff is really impressive cool I think

1560
01:04:09,470 --> 01:04:07,380
the one thing I mean a lot of those

1561
01:04:10,849 --> 01:04:09,480
people like I also want to say this like

1562
01:04:12,410 --> 01:04:10,859
a lot of them

1563
01:04:14,270 --> 01:04:12,420
um I would have been one of those people

1564
01:04:19,250 --> 01:04:14,280
if the internet would have done what it

1565
01:04:25,130 --> 01:04:19,260
was when I was like 17 to 25. because

1566
01:04:27,829 --> 01:04:25,140
the the like nap and the S4 saucer I

1567
01:04:30,289 --> 01:04:27,839
think like I have I had I did Art when I

1568
01:04:34,130 --> 01:04:30,299
was in school about the SR the S4 saucer

1569
01:04:36,890 --> 01:04:34,140
like I was a hundred percent

1570
01:04:40,130 --> 01:04:36,900
down that rabbit hole then I just I mean

1571
01:04:42,170 --> 01:04:40,140
a lot of my take now is because I've I

1572
01:04:44,510 --> 01:04:42,180
like I literally lived through the cycle

1573
01:04:46,370 --> 01:04:44,520
where

1574
01:04:49,670 --> 01:04:46,380
um that's what I said you know in in

1575
01:04:52,309 --> 01:04:49,680
like an aging Jeremy Corbell doing a

1576
01:04:54,349 --> 01:04:52,319
documentary like where is Louis lozondo

1577
01:04:58,430 --> 01:04:54,359
now like remember all that [\h__\h] that

1578
01:05:01,190 --> 01:04:58,440
happened 20 years ago because

1579
01:05:03,349 --> 01:05:01,200
like and this is why I feel bad because

1580
01:05:04,910 --> 01:05:03,359
again I want to emphasize that like I

1581
01:05:06,650 --> 01:05:04,920
really did think we were on the verge of

1582
01:05:09,049 --> 01:05:06,660
some kind of disclosure moment all the

1583
01:05:11,450 --> 01:05:09,059
fiction was providing us the you know it

1584
01:05:13,970 --> 01:05:11,460
was loosen our minds up for this and

1585
01:05:17,750 --> 01:05:13,980
then uh you know everybody it's like you

1586
01:05:19,370 --> 01:05:17,760
got UFO blue balls and it's just going

1587
01:05:22,309 --> 01:05:19,380
to happen again

1588
01:05:24,109 --> 01:05:22,319
yeah probably yeah and also I mean this

1589
01:05:26,089 --> 01:05:24,119
idea this always reminds me of like

1590
01:05:27,890 --> 01:05:26,099
conversations about disclosure like one

1591
01:05:29,690 --> 01:05:27,900
is even in the best case scenario

1592
01:05:31,250 --> 01:05:29,700
disclosure feels to me like in a merger

1593
01:05:33,230 --> 01:05:31,260
process right it's not going to be just

1594
01:05:35,510 --> 01:05:33,240
a discreet event but the other thing too

1595
01:05:37,370 --> 01:05:35,520
this goes back to things I've said many

1596
01:05:38,870 --> 01:05:37,380
times on this show I certainly don't

1597
01:05:42,470 --> 01:05:38,880
trust the government or any sort of

1598
01:05:44,809 --> 01:05:42,480
institutional authority figure to be the

1599
01:05:47,210 --> 01:05:44,819
place that is spearheading disclosure in

1600
01:05:49,270 --> 01:05:47,220
anything the people that are covering it

1601
01:05:52,190 --> 01:05:49,280
up yeah yeah

1602
01:05:53,690 --> 01:05:52,200
it's a very long history of the

1603
01:05:57,230 --> 01:05:53,700
government

1604
01:05:59,450 --> 01:05:57,240
either actively disrupting or

1605
01:06:01,250 --> 01:05:59,460
infiltrating these kinds of spaces and

1606
01:06:03,650 --> 01:06:01,260
using them for Miss and disinformation

1607
01:06:05,089 --> 01:06:03,660
campaigns or you don't actually have to

1608
01:06:07,970 --> 01:06:05,099
be dude you don't have to be like a

1609
01:06:09,230 --> 01:06:07,980
conspiracy theorist to understand and

1610
01:06:10,490 --> 01:06:09,240
recognize that there's a long and

1611
01:06:12,650 --> 01:06:10,500
storied history of the US government

1612
01:06:14,450 --> 01:06:12,660
acting in deeply harmful ways towards

1613
01:06:15,049 --> 01:06:14,460
its own citizens

1614
01:06:16,849 --> 01:06:15,059
um

1615
01:06:19,010 --> 01:06:16,859
through these through these venues and

1616
01:06:21,589 --> 01:06:19,020
to me it also feels like ufology or kind

1617
01:06:23,030 --> 01:06:21,599
of a lot of the ufological spaces or

1618
01:06:24,170 --> 01:06:23,040
basically Proving Grounds for a lot of

1619
01:06:26,690 --> 01:06:24,180
this Behavior

1620
01:06:29,390 --> 01:06:26,700
I think what bothers me about it is two

1621
01:06:30,049 --> 01:06:29,400
things the first being that it is a

1622
01:06:30,950 --> 01:06:30,059
little

1623
01:06:32,930 --> 01:06:30,960
um

1624
01:06:35,089 --> 01:06:32,940
I don't think anybody realizes kind of

1625
01:06:36,410 --> 01:06:35,099
how flexible they're being we're saying

1626
01:06:38,390 --> 01:06:36,420
like I don't believe anything government

1627
01:06:39,829 --> 01:06:38,400
says except we're going to twist their

1628
01:06:42,829 --> 01:06:39,839
arm to get them to finally tell the

1629
01:06:45,349 --> 01:06:42,839
truth this one time for sure

1630
01:06:47,630 --> 01:06:45,359
like disclosure happens it's like okay

1631
01:06:49,010 --> 01:06:47,640
this is really it it's like what you

1632
01:06:50,870 --> 01:06:49,020
think you swear

1633
01:06:51,770 --> 01:06:50,880
and I know we've talked about this

1634
01:06:53,150 --> 01:06:51,780
before

1635
01:06:56,390 --> 01:06:53,160
um

1636
01:06:58,069 --> 01:06:56,400
you really like there's a an idea that I

1637
01:07:01,250 --> 01:06:58,079
don't know what it is it reminds me of

1638
01:07:03,289 --> 01:07:01,260
the original Far Side cartoon where uh

1639
01:07:04,849 --> 01:07:03,299
you know Professor types the lab coat

1640
01:07:06,289 --> 01:07:04,859
guys are drawing this massive equation

1641
01:07:08,270 --> 01:07:06,299
and then they get to the middle of it

1642
01:07:10,970 --> 01:07:08,280
and it says then the miracle occurs and

1643
01:07:13,849 --> 01:07:10,980
the rest of it goes back so disclosure

1644
01:07:16,010 --> 01:07:13,859
is a little bit like then the miracle

1645
01:07:18,770 --> 01:07:16,020
occurs because it seems like people are

1646
01:07:21,289 --> 01:07:18,780
going to compromise a lot of a lot of

1647
01:07:23,630 --> 01:07:21,299
values in the face of like it doesn't

1648
01:07:25,309 --> 01:07:23,640
matter like it doesn't matter if I go on

1649
01:07:28,549 --> 01:07:25,319
like the worst News Network on the world

1650
01:07:29,870 --> 01:07:28,559
as long as disclosure happens or and it

1651
01:07:32,329 --> 01:07:29,880
doesn't matter how bad this politician

1652
01:07:35,089 --> 01:07:32,339
is because he's behind us on this

1653
01:07:38,569 --> 01:07:35,099
but I want to Circle all the way back

1654
01:07:40,609 --> 01:07:38,579
and say none of this to me says that

1655
01:07:42,770 --> 01:07:40,619
aliens never aren't real and never

1656
01:07:44,870 --> 01:07:42,780
visited the

1657
01:07:47,750 --> 01:07:44,880
planet Earth because there are some

1658
01:07:51,289 --> 01:07:47,760
actually truly strange cases but I think

1659
01:07:54,829 --> 01:07:51,299
those are more of the edge cases and

1660
01:07:56,870 --> 01:07:54,839
The X-Files Mythos that were still

1661
01:07:58,010 --> 01:07:56,880
attempting to live He's just distracted

1662
01:08:02,690 --> 01:07:58,020
from

1663
01:08:08,329 --> 01:08:05,750
Yeah well yeah why is uh why is where

1664
01:08:10,910 --> 01:08:08,339
it's Jagged entirely and I just like to

1665
01:08:11,809 --> 01:08:10,920
say we have somebody else in the uh back

1666
01:08:14,690 --> 01:08:11,819
here

1667
01:08:16,249 --> 01:08:14,700
um telezma blorb who is actually I think

1668
01:08:19,970 --> 01:08:16,259
is that next week that she's uh coming

1669
01:08:23,150 --> 01:08:19,980
up yeah so uh he'll add now

1670
01:08:25,610 --> 01:08:23,160
well six of us yeah it's basically a

1671
01:08:28,849 --> 01:08:25,620
party now hello

1672
01:08:33,590 --> 01:08:30,470
how are you tonight

1673
01:08:35,689 --> 01:08:33,600
I'm doing okay just enjoying the show I

1674
01:08:38,630 --> 01:08:35,699
I don't really follow all this stuff so

1675
01:08:41,150 --> 01:08:38,640
all of this information about Arrow I'm

1676
01:08:44,030 --> 01:08:41,160
getting from listening to other people

1677
01:08:46,269 --> 01:08:44,040
who have processed it because I just

1678
01:08:49,990 --> 01:08:46,279
would rather just not

1679
01:08:52,910 --> 01:08:50,000
I better follow myself

1680
01:08:55,610 --> 01:08:52,920
well from uh did you say you didn't

1681
01:08:57,590 --> 01:08:55,620
follow it himself um what's your uh

1682
01:08:59,450 --> 01:08:57,600
interpretation then if you're sort of

1683
01:09:03,349 --> 01:08:59,460
just collecting all the information from

1684
01:09:05,990 --> 01:09:03,359
The Ether what's your text

1685
01:09:08,209 --> 01:09:06,000
uh I mean it just sounds like the same

1686
01:09:09,590 --> 01:09:08,219
the same stuff you know it doesn't it

1687
01:09:12,470 --> 01:09:09,600
doesn't sound like any new information

1688
01:09:15,769 --> 01:09:12,480
but that's the thing like if I had my

1689
01:09:18,709 --> 01:09:15,779
choice I would just read about like you

1690
01:09:21,289 --> 01:09:18,719
know the electromagnetic anomalies of

1691
01:09:23,150 --> 01:09:21,299
the earth and like variable and crap you

1692
01:09:25,610 --> 01:09:23,160
know I would never I don't want to know

1693
01:09:29,570 --> 01:09:25,620
the name Brian bugle I I don't I don't

1694
01:09:33,709 --> 01:09:30,890
[Music]

1695
01:09:36,590 --> 01:09:33,719
understandable completely

1696
01:09:38,930 --> 01:09:36,600
yeah I I mean is is this kind of the

1697
01:09:40,610 --> 01:09:38,940
general consensus across everybody then

1698
01:09:43,789 --> 01:09:40,620
that's hearing was just kind of like

1699
01:09:51,050 --> 01:09:45,769
well I mean it's it's kind of nothing

1700
01:09:54,350 --> 01:09:53,090
for National Security narratives that

1701
01:09:56,209 --> 01:09:54,360
are just by being packaged and

1702
01:09:57,290 --> 01:09:56,219
repackaged in new and innovative ways

1703
01:09:58,490 --> 01:09:57,300
right

1704
01:10:01,310 --> 01:09:58,500
um and to me that's sort of what this

1705
01:10:03,350 --> 01:10:01,320
feels like intuitively yeah is it's just

1706
01:10:04,669 --> 01:10:03,360
more Comfort I mean even if you look at

1707
01:10:06,350 --> 01:10:04,679
the lobbying group rate the one that

1708
01:10:08,330 --> 01:10:06,360
Ryan Graves runs isn't it called like

1709
01:10:11,689 --> 01:10:08,340
citizens for safe Aerospace or something

1710
01:10:13,310 --> 01:10:11,699
like that like it's it's typically well

1711
01:10:14,570 --> 01:10:13,320
it's it's like a lot of it feels like a

1712
01:10:16,310 --> 01:10:14,580
lot of these narratives especially at

1713
01:10:18,169 --> 01:10:16,320
the government slash military level are

1714
01:10:20,930 --> 01:10:18,179
couched very deeply in these narratives

1715
01:10:23,149 --> 01:10:20,940
around National Security and protection

1716
01:10:24,950 --> 01:10:23,159
um which I think for the average person

1717
01:10:26,630 --> 01:10:24,960
like not a UFO person but the average

1718
01:10:28,370 --> 01:10:26,640
person that's basically like the Red

1719
01:10:32,470 --> 01:10:28,380
Menace which could be either Russia or

1720
01:10:39,709 --> 01:10:36,610
uh yeah I I think um

1721
01:10:42,169 --> 01:10:39,719
Mike's concern about all of this uh like

1722
01:10:44,630 --> 01:10:42,179
is is uh that you know there's this

1723
01:10:48,770 --> 01:10:44,640
clear you know very unified sort of UFO

1724
01:10:49,850 --> 01:10:48,780
party right like big UFO and

1725
01:10:52,790 --> 01:10:49,860
um

1726
01:10:54,770 --> 01:10:52,800
and and it's a very cohesive organized

1727
01:10:57,410 --> 01:10:54,780
movement and that it's a religious

1728
01:10:59,330 --> 01:10:57,420
movement but it's one where large

1729
01:11:01,189 --> 01:10:59,340
portions of the movement don't realize

1730
01:11:03,709 --> 01:11:01,199
they're in a religion because it doesn't

1731
01:11:05,890 --> 01:11:03,719
have a name you know

1732
01:11:08,510 --> 01:11:05,900
um they think that's just reality

1733
01:11:13,070 --> 01:11:08,520
because they're being tricked you know

1734
01:11:15,590 --> 01:11:13,080
and and and and so the lobbyists the UFO

1735
01:11:19,070 --> 01:11:15,600
lobbyists like Leslie Kane that's a

1736
01:11:21,770 --> 01:11:19,080
total conflict of interest uh to the US

1737
01:11:24,110 --> 01:11:21,780
you know it's it's a breach of uh of

1738
01:11:25,790 --> 01:11:24,120
separation of church and state you know

1739
01:11:27,890 --> 01:11:25,800
what I mean

1740
01:11:28,910 --> 01:11:27,900
that's that's a spicy take I kind of

1741
01:11:32,390 --> 01:11:28,920
like it

1742
01:11:34,729 --> 01:11:32,400
oh boy it's more speculative I'm

1743
01:11:38,030 --> 01:11:34,739
speculating yeah well let's take a look

1744
01:11:40,250 --> 01:11:38,040
at the uh the culture of the religion uh

1745
01:11:41,750 --> 01:11:40,260
if we want to take a look at it that way

1746
01:11:44,390 --> 01:11:41,760
um I mean it's not organized obviously

1747
01:11:45,770 --> 01:11:44,400
but it is a set of beliefs that um you

1748
01:11:48,050 --> 01:11:45,780
know it could be argued to have a

1749
01:11:48,770 --> 01:11:48,060
structure of a sort

1750
01:11:50,510 --> 01:11:48,780
um

1751
01:11:52,790 --> 01:11:50,520
if you look at it you know when I

1752
01:11:55,370 --> 01:11:52,800
started looking at UFOs at 2021 for the

1753
01:11:56,689 --> 01:11:55,380
first time it was within the virus uh

1754
01:11:58,790 --> 01:11:56,699
you know my brain was open to new

1755
01:12:00,350 --> 01:11:58,800
information because of the trauma of

1756
01:12:02,090 --> 01:12:00,360
that whole thing and that's how trauma

1757
01:12:03,410 --> 01:12:02,100
works it opens your brain a new info I

1758
01:12:05,930 --> 01:12:03,420
was like okay I'll take a look at this

1759
01:12:07,850 --> 01:12:05,940
that would be funny if uh none of this

1760
01:12:09,649 --> 01:12:07,860
really like if the aliens are here that

1761
01:12:12,229 --> 01:12:09,659
would be kind of hilarious

1762
01:12:15,229 --> 01:12:13,910
it's like uh this might change things up

1763
01:12:17,630 --> 01:12:15,239
that might be cool so you know I

1764
01:12:19,250 --> 01:12:17,640
understand there's like uh people like

1765
01:12:20,750 --> 01:12:19,260
talk about disclosure it's like it's

1766
01:12:22,430 --> 01:12:20,760
about it being like this huge thing that

1767
01:12:23,930 --> 01:12:22,440
changes the world like that's sort of

1768
01:12:25,970 --> 01:12:23,940
like the core

1769
01:12:28,669 --> 01:12:25,980
thing here right like that a lot of

1770
01:12:30,410 --> 01:12:28,679
these people grab onto and it's like it

1771
01:12:33,350 --> 01:12:30,420
kind of excuses a lot of things it's

1772
01:12:34,790 --> 01:12:33,360
like if the aliens are here and they can

1773
01:12:37,070 --> 01:12:34,800
bring in these Advanced Technologies

1774
01:12:39,290 --> 01:12:37,080
that'll change the world then what what

1775
01:12:41,209 --> 01:12:39,300
is unjustifiable what what is

1776
01:12:42,110 --> 01:12:41,219
justifiable right like it goes pretty

1777
01:12:44,209 --> 01:12:42,120
far

1778
01:12:45,709 --> 01:12:44,219
So like

1779
01:12:48,590 --> 01:12:45,719
um

1780
01:12:50,450 --> 01:12:48,600
like Jay and the television like each of

1781
01:12:53,030 --> 01:12:50,460
you maybe uh plasma if you could answer

1782
01:12:55,370 --> 01:12:53,040
first like is there something that you

1783
01:12:57,530 --> 01:12:55,380
identified that brought you into this

1784
01:13:00,830 --> 01:12:57,540
initially like looking at these sort of

1785
01:13:03,050 --> 01:13:00,840
uh things on the edge uh like what what

1786
01:13:03,770 --> 01:13:03,060
brought you in

1787
01:13:07,130 --> 01:13:03,780
um

1788
01:13:08,750 --> 01:13:07,140
well uh you mean just like uh the

1789
01:13:11,030 --> 01:13:08,760
anomalous and like the Paranormal in

1790
01:13:11,870 --> 01:13:11,040
general like streams yes

1791
01:13:14,330 --> 01:13:11,880
um

1792
01:13:17,570 --> 01:13:14,340
well I've really been interested in it

1793
01:13:19,430 --> 01:13:17,580
since I was uh

1794
01:13:20,450 --> 01:13:19,440
very young

1795
01:13:23,090 --> 01:13:20,460
um

1796
01:13:25,490 --> 01:13:23,100
and uh

1797
01:13:29,510 --> 01:13:25,500
you know some of my earliest member I I

1798
01:13:31,870 --> 01:13:29,520
have a very early memory of being in a

1799
01:13:36,169 --> 01:13:31,880
library in New Jersey

1800
01:13:40,189 --> 01:13:36,179
and looking on like you know like one of

1801
01:13:43,790 --> 01:13:40,199
those old like uh Max or something like

1802
01:13:46,430 --> 01:13:43,800
a really old clear box I mean the green

1803
01:13:49,370 --> 01:13:46,440
pixels like that way back in the 80s

1804
01:13:51,790 --> 01:13:49,380
this is like in the late 80s this is

1805
01:13:54,470 --> 01:13:51,800
like a Lisa

1806
01:13:57,590 --> 01:13:54,480
Nick Nick has one of these I think these

1807
01:13:59,390 --> 01:13:57,600
were called Lisa's yeah oh yeah the

1808
01:14:00,950 --> 01:13:59,400
least that's that's her nip that's how

1809
01:14:06,350 --> 01:14:00,960
Nick talks to his internet girlfriends

1810
01:14:09,410 --> 01:14:06,360
on that thing the local BBS yeah

1811
01:14:11,450 --> 01:14:09,420
um yeah yeah but yeah like and and

1812
01:14:14,090 --> 01:14:11,460
looking for information about the Jersey

1813
01:14:15,950 --> 01:14:14,100
Devil I was at that age very obsessed

1814
01:14:19,430 --> 01:14:15,960
with the Jersey Devil and a Loch Ness

1815
01:14:22,550 --> 01:14:19,440
monster I was probably five years old

1816
01:14:24,950 --> 01:14:22,560
um and and I I I got into UFOs a few

1817
01:14:26,810 --> 01:14:24,960
years after that I think you know I

1818
01:14:30,229 --> 01:14:26,820
remember having vivid dreams of like

1819
01:14:32,149 --> 01:14:30,239
giant squid and ecclesiosaurs and stuff

1820
01:14:35,510 --> 01:14:32,159
like that you know

1821
01:14:37,430 --> 01:14:35,520
so it's it's it's been a fixation

1822
01:14:39,470 --> 01:14:37,440
pretty much my entire life for as long

1823
01:14:41,090 --> 01:14:39,480
as I remember

1824
01:14:43,370 --> 01:14:41,100
I mean this subject is like everyone's

1825
01:14:44,750 --> 01:14:43,380
lifetime Affliction right like I I I'm

1826
01:14:46,130 --> 01:14:44,760
sitting in my office right now and I

1827
01:14:47,810 --> 01:14:46,140
have a drawing that I did of an alien

1828
01:14:49,070 --> 01:14:47,820
when I was in second grade right that my

1829
01:14:50,810 --> 01:14:49,080
mom found when she was cleaning her

1830
01:14:53,689 --> 01:14:50,820
basement and was like see Thea you've

1831
01:14:58,910 --> 01:14:53,699
never changed and it's so accessible are

1832
01:15:02,689 --> 01:15:00,110
um it's funny Jay you were talking about

1833
01:15:05,570 --> 01:15:02,699
being into this in school I remember

1834
01:15:07,910 --> 01:15:05,580
um in I want to say it was seventh grade

1835
01:15:09,830 --> 01:15:07,920
in tech ed we we did Screen Printing and

1836
01:15:11,570 --> 01:15:09,840
I remember screen printing one of the

1837
01:15:13,790 --> 01:15:11,580
sketches of an alien gray out of Bud

1838
01:15:15,890 --> 01:15:13,800
Hopkins Intruders which I checked out

1839
01:15:19,130 --> 01:15:15,900
from the school library uh that very

1840
01:15:22,130 --> 01:15:19,140
school so yeah it's been I almost wound

1841
01:15:23,630 --> 01:15:22,140
up at Art School too so the

1842
01:15:25,930 --> 01:15:23,640
seven-year-old but yeah right and your

1843
01:15:29,209 --> 01:15:25,940
portfolio yeah that's a really good

1844
01:15:30,290 --> 01:15:29,219
drawing yeah mail it interprets to you

1845
01:15:32,209 --> 01:15:30,300
when I was applying to their friends

1846
01:15:34,310 --> 01:15:32,219
that's very cool I think your mom just

1847
01:15:36,950 --> 01:15:34,320
drew it and like told you that you

1848
01:15:40,130 --> 01:15:36,960
dropped you know so you confabulate the

1849
01:15:44,390 --> 01:15:40,140
memory yes

1850
01:15:44,400 --> 01:15:48,110
oh

1851
01:15:55,010 --> 01:15:51,470
sorry yeah

1852
01:15:57,189 --> 01:15:55,020
no I muted Jay oh he's unmuted now you

1853
01:16:00,950 --> 01:15:57,199
can talk

1854
01:16:03,290 --> 01:16:00,960
Unleashed um I actually yeah a lot of

1855
01:16:06,290 --> 01:16:03,300
that stuff so

1856
01:16:07,790 --> 01:16:06,300
I am I am a child of the 80s and I think

1857
01:16:10,729 --> 01:16:07,800
um a lot of the stuff you're gonna

1858
01:16:12,950 --> 01:16:10,739
remember like the seven like 70s was

1859
01:16:14,990 --> 01:16:12,960
really like the error where all that

1860
01:16:17,270 --> 01:16:15,000
stuff peaked and there are so many books

1861
01:16:20,270 --> 01:16:17,280
published about it just even if they

1862
01:16:22,550 --> 01:16:20,280
were trashed like miscellaneous books

1863
01:16:24,610 --> 01:16:22,560
about you know this Bermuda Triangle

1864
01:16:27,470 --> 01:16:24,620
there were a couple

1865
01:16:31,310 --> 01:16:27,480
you know UFO books there was a lot of

1866
01:16:33,770 --> 01:16:31,320
that stuff around and I just remember

1867
01:16:36,050 --> 01:16:33,780
um soaking it up in like School

1868
01:16:38,630 --> 01:16:36,060
libraries I think

1869
01:16:41,149 --> 01:16:38,640
um you know like even my parents were

1870
01:16:43,490 --> 01:16:41,159
just like very normal people had some of

1871
01:16:45,370 --> 01:16:43,500
that stuff because it was like 70s you

1872
01:16:48,290 --> 01:16:45,380
couldn't how could you

1873
01:16:50,390 --> 01:16:48,300
yeah and it sounds like plasma is sort

1874
01:16:52,370 --> 01:16:50,400
of the same it's like the we're of the

1875
01:16:55,450 --> 01:16:52,380
um spontaneous combustion generation

1876
01:16:57,649 --> 01:16:55,460
yeah so whatever happened to that right

1877
01:16:58,490 --> 01:16:57,659
and I thought that was going to be a

1878
01:17:01,010 --> 01:16:58,500
much

1879
01:17:03,709 --> 01:17:01,020
um more dire thing I'd have to face as

1880
01:17:06,410 --> 01:17:03,719
in moving into adulthood

1881
01:17:08,510 --> 01:17:06,420
but uh yeah all that stuff imprinted on

1882
01:17:09,470 --> 01:17:08,520
me but I do think

1883
01:17:11,209 --> 01:17:09,480
um

1884
01:17:13,310 --> 01:17:11,219
I think some of us are just kind of

1885
01:17:15,590 --> 01:17:13,320
caught from that cloth because like I

1886
01:17:17,810 --> 01:17:15,600
want like the weird everything like if

1887
01:17:19,790 --> 01:17:17,820
you were like your two pens it's like

1888
01:17:23,090 --> 01:17:19,800
the standard Bic panoris and it's weird

1889
01:17:26,570 --> 01:17:23,100
I'm like give me the weird pad and

1890
01:17:29,750 --> 01:17:26,580
that's just my personal uh polarity

1891
01:17:35,390 --> 01:17:31,370
uh

1892
01:17:39,350 --> 01:17:35,400
did that actually happen or is that a

1893
01:17:43,430 --> 01:17:40,630
what's that

1894
01:17:45,229 --> 01:17:43,440
Brooke made a comment quote I told my

1895
01:17:46,729 --> 01:17:45,239
brother that my parents were lizards and

1896
01:17:48,590 --> 01:17:46,739
took their faces off at night and I

1897
01:17:50,270 --> 01:17:48,600
wasn't allowed to talk aliens after that

1898
01:17:51,470 --> 01:17:50,280
right yeah it probably scared your

1899
01:17:53,709 --> 01:17:51,480
little brother so much that your parents

1900
01:17:58,010 --> 01:17:53,719
were like [\h__\h] you little [\h__\h] no more

1901
01:18:01,310 --> 01:17:58,020
but uh I also remembered being really

1902
01:18:03,290 --> 01:18:01,320
young and wondering if the um the rest

1903
01:18:04,850 --> 01:18:03,300
of the like world was there when I was

1904
01:18:07,310 --> 01:18:04,860
looking

1905
01:18:09,410 --> 01:18:07,320
oh yeah I can remember thinking that

1906
01:18:11,630 --> 01:18:09,420
when I was when I was very young I've

1907
01:18:13,669 --> 01:18:11,640
always had this preoccupation with the

1908
01:18:15,530 --> 01:18:13,679
various strange and the weird Jay when

1909
01:18:17,090 --> 01:18:15,540
you said if I had two equal things and

1910
01:18:19,490 --> 01:18:17,100
one was weird and one was normal and the

1911
01:18:21,669 --> 01:18:19,500
same way I'd always pick the weird thing

1912
01:18:25,010 --> 01:18:21,679
um and I'm I'm from a family that is

1913
01:18:27,590 --> 01:18:25,020
Normie Beyond Norby right I am like even

1914
01:18:29,390 --> 01:18:27,600
my extended family and God bless my

1915
01:18:31,790 --> 01:18:29,400
parents who are super supportive of How

1916
01:18:35,149 --> 01:18:31,800
Deeply [\h__\h] weird I can be

1917
01:18:36,950 --> 01:18:35,159
um but it does feel almost like a baked

1918
01:18:38,570 --> 01:18:36,960
in personality trait or disposition

1919
01:18:40,130 --> 01:18:38,580
because I feel like so many people that

1920
01:18:42,050 --> 01:18:40,140
I talk to in and around these spaces

1921
01:18:44,030 --> 01:18:42,060
will have very similar narratives right

1922
01:18:46,430 --> 01:18:44,040
this is these are preoccupations that

1923
01:18:48,350 --> 01:18:46,440
have been with them

1924
01:18:50,209 --> 01:18:48,360
um then I mean I like look I'm super

1925
01:18:51,830 --> 01:18:50,219
open about this I I pretty regularly

1926
01:18:54,110 --> 01:18:51,840
engage with and have had experiences

1927
01:18:56,149 --> 01:18:54,120
that have fundamentally disrupted and

1928
01:18:58,370 --> 01:18:56,159
broken down my ontologies right like

1929
01:18:59,689 --> 01:18:58,380
I've I've had ego dissolving and ego

1930
01:19:00,950 --> 01:18:59,699
death experiences I've deliberately

1931
01:19:02,870 --> 01:19:00,960
sought these things out like

1932
01:19:06,830 --> 01:19:02,880
deliberately sought out things that will

1933
01:19:08,570 --> 01:19:06,840
uh fracture and refactor my perception

1934
01:19:09,770 --> 01:19:08,580
of the world and my experience of

1935
01:19:12,410 --> 01:19:09,780
reality

1936
01:19:13,729 --> 01:19:12,420
um I have this huge huge appetite for it

1937
01:19:15,470 --> 01:19:13,739
um and I think it's just something you

1938
01:19:18,050 --> 01:19:15,480
know these kinds of experiences I love

1939
01:19:19,669 --> 01:19:18,060
them and find not only satisfaction in

1940
01:19:22,790 --> 01:19:19,679
meaning in them but just find sort of

1941
01:19:24,770 --> 01:19:22,800
this adventurous experience

1942
01:19:27,290 --> 01:19:24,780
um really kind of gratifying but there

1943
01:19:28,790 --> 01:19:27,300
are also things that if you don't want

1944
01:19:30,290 --> 01:19:28,800
them and you don't have that appetite

1945
01:19:32,330 --> 01:19:30,300
they're deeply traumatic and really

1946
01:19:33,830 --> 01:19:32,340
harmful and upsetting

1947
01:19:36,169 --> 01:19:33,840
um and I don't just mean psychedelics I

1948
01:19:38,090 --> 01:19:36,179
mean even like spiritual emergence uh

1949
01:19:40,250 --> 01:19:38,100
meditation sessions like deep meditation

1950
01:19:41,689 --> 01:19:40,260
can cause like really deleterious

1951
01:19:43,970 --> 01:19:41,699
effects in some people can lead to

1952
01:19:45,649 --> 01:19:43,980
dissociation manic episodes psychosis

1953
01:19:47,570 --> 01:19:45,659
things like that

1954
01:19:49,790 --> 01:19:47,580
um and I do just think it's something

1955
01:19:52,669 --> 01:19:49,800
that can be like basically innate like

1956
01:19:55,610 --> 01:19:52,679
woven into somebody's disposition

1957
01:19:58,550 --> 01:19:55,620
yeah I I uh I think um

1958
01:20:01,910 --> 01:19:58,560
I agree with you and I think a major

1959
01:20:06,169 --> 01:20:01,920
problem in our culture personally is

1960
01:20:09,470 --> 01:20:06,179
that you know and especially around like

1961
01:20:12,110 --> 01:20:09,480
Wu and UFO culture is this idea that

1962
01:20:15,169 --> 01:20:12,120
ontological shock is something I think

1963
01:20:16,790 --> 01:20:15,179
that people make it a lot scarier than

1964
01:20:18,890 --> 01:20:16,800
it actually is

1965
01:20:22,010 --> 01:20:18,900
um you know for me I that's I was just

1966
01:20:25,189 --> 01:20:22,020
writing about this yesterday like I seek

1967
01:20:26,870 --> 01:20:25,199
out ontological shock as well not

1968
01:20:28,130 --> 01:20:26,880
exactly the same kind that you're

1969
01:20:30,890 --> 01:20:28,140
talking about but I mean it's still

1970
01:20:33,350 --> 01:20:30,900
ontological shock and I think you know

1971
01:20:37,310 --> 01:20:33,360
ontological shock is a good thing

1972
01:20:39,890 --> 01:20:37,320
because we live in a universe that's

1973
01:20:42,530 --> 01:20:39,900
always changing all the time and we're

1974
01:20:45,709 --> 01:20:42,540
not static objects we are Dynamic

1975
01:20:49,490 --> 01:20:45,719
systems and like I think people have

1976
01:20:52,910 --> 01:20:49,500
become very vulnerable because they're

1977
01:20:55,430 --> 01:20:52,920
afraid you know that they kind of start

1978
01:20:58,430 --> 01:20:55,440
getting these the protective or

1979
01:21:01,370 --> 01:20:58,440
authentic authoritarian mindsets of

1980
01:21:03,590 --> 01:21:01,380
being like well this has to be true you

1981
01:21:04,370 --> 01:21:03,600
know or they look to mystery and they

1982
01:21:07,370 --> 01:21:04,380
place

1983
01:21:09,890 --> 01:21:07,380
a picture on it you know an illustration

1984
01:21:12,410 --> 01:21:09,900
of Jesus basically

1985
01:21:15,770 --> 01:21:12,420
and and so when an ontological happened

1986
01:21:18,169 --> 01:21:15,780
shock happens it makes it so much worse

1987
01:21:21,229 --> 01:21:18,179
for them it it it it makes them

1988
01:21:23,870 --> 01:21:21,239
vulnerable to that

1989
01:21:24,470 --> 01:21:23,880
I I think to

1990
01:21:28,850 --> 01:21:24,480
um

1991
01:21:34,490 --> 01:21:32,330
we tend we I mean like collectively as a

1992
01:21:37,610 --> 01:21:34,500
culture or Society we tend to assign

1993
01:21:39,950 --> 01:21:37,620
value judgments to them right it isn't

1994
01:21:42,169 --> 01:21:39,960
either or a situation not a both and

1995
01:21:44,570 --> 01:21:42,179
right you can have these very strange

1996
01:21:46,729 --> 01:21:44,580
mysterious experiences

1997
01:21:49,130 --> 01:21:46,739
um and you are there for pathologized

1998
01:21:51,649 --> 01:21:49,140
into having something wrong with you

1999
01:21:52,970 --> 01:21:51,659
um or opinions or views that cannot or

2000
01:21:54,290 --> 01:21:52,980
should not be trusted and you I mean you

2001
01:21:55,850 --> 01:21:54,300
see a lot of this with like spiritual

2002
01:21:58,070 --> 01:21:55,860
emergence and then people being

2003
01:21:59,510 --> 01:21:58,080
diagnosed as manic uh and being

2004
01:22:00,590 --> 01:21:59,520
medicated

2005
01:22:02,750 --> 01:22:00,600
um now this does not mean that

2006
01:22:04,490 --> 01:22:02,760
medication is bad doesn't mean it's not

2007
01:22:07,430 --> 01:22:04,500
helpful or useful that pathologies

2008
01:22:08,390 --> 01:22:07,440
should be dismissed but there are

2009
01:22:11,950 --> 01:22:08,400
um

2010
01:22:14,870 --> 01:22:11,960
many different processes and

2011
01:22:17,090 --> 01:22:14,880
Pathways towards wholeness when people

2012
01:22:18,830 --> 01:22:17,100
experience these things and I think you

2013
01:22:21,530 --> 01:22:18,840
know I think I think part of this

2014
01:22:23,450 --> 01:22:21,540
proclivity towards pathologizing these

2015
01:22:28,130 --> 01:22:23,460
kinds of things is basically because

2016
01:22:29,990 --> 01:22:28,140
they are directly contrary to uh frankly

2017
01:22:32,330 --> 01:22:30,000
capitalism right they make you shitty

2018
01:22:35,090 --> 01:22:32,340
workers they make you less inclined

2019
01:22:37,790 --> 01:22:35,100
towards hyper materialism or

2020
01:22:41,510 --> 01:22:37,800
productivity and so much of our kind of

2021
01:22:43,850 --> 01:22:41,520
mental health apparatus is not really

2022
01:22:45,649 --> 01:22:43,860
focused on a holistic approach towards

2023
01:22:47,149 --> 01:22:45,659
integration and wholeness but rather on

2024
01:22:49,669 --> 01:22:47,159
just getting you up and working again

2025
01:22:52,010 --> 01:22:49,679
writing your JavaScript or slinging

2026
01:22:54,830 --> 01:22:52,020
plates at a restaurant or whatever

2027
01:22:56,510 --> 01:22:54,840
um and I you know I

2028
01:22:57,290 --> 01:22:56,520
if I'm going to pull back the curtain a

2029
01:22:58,790 --> 01:22:57,300
lot

2030
01:23:00,350 --> 01:22:58,800
um you know one of my personally held

2031
01:23:02,450 --> 01:23:00,360
beliefs is that we live in a culture

2032
01:23:04,310 --> 01:23:02,460
that is so hungry for meaning and sense

2033
01:23:06,229 --> 01:23:04,320
making and even

2034
01:23:08,090 --> 01:23:06,239
um experience of the mysterious that

2035
01:23:10,070 --> 01:23:08,100
these desires become transmuted into

2036
01:23:12,350 --> 01:23:10,080
like basically

2037
01:23:13,850 --> 01:23:12,360
um an illness social socially and

2038
01:23:15,410 --> 01:23:13,860
culturally because we have such poor

2039
01:23:17,149 --> 01:23:15,420
narratives for exploring it in our

2040
01:23:19,070 --> 01:23:17,159
present moment and when you do explore

2041
01:23:20,450 --> 01:23:19,080
it it can be highly stigmatized or

2042
01:23:22,330 --> 01:23:20,460
ostracizing

2043
01:23:24,110 --> 01:23:22,340
um early to just being like you know

2044
01:23:27,770 --> 01:23:24,120
inappropriately interpreting and

2045
01:23:33,229 --> 01:23:31,010
let's see you know you see that

2046
01:23:34,729 --> 01:23:33,239
um I'm going to say this a little bit in

2047
01:23:36,830 --> 01:23:34,739
defense of not wanting to have an

2048
01:23:38,570 --> 01:23:36,840
oncological shock but it's it's what you

2049
01:23:42,290 --> 01:23:38,580
said it's like I don't have time for

2050
01:23:44,570 --> 01:23:42,300
that man I think two two of my favorite

2051
01:23:47,030 --> 01:23:44,580
um memes that I see UFO memes going

2052
01:23:49,630 --> 01:23:47,040
around are you know it's Fox Mulder's

2053
01:23:53,270 --> 01:23:49,640
poster except it says I want to leave

2054
01:23:55,430 --> 01:23:53,280
I love that one and the um wojacks where

2055
01:23:57,350 --> 01:23:55,440
there's like you know the the burner the

2056
01:23:59,209 --> 01:23:57,360
um like the burnout wojak the guy with

2057
01:24:02,209 --> 01:23:59,219
the cap who smokes and there's a gray

2058
01:24:04,250 --> 01:24:02,219
and the gray says aren't you shocked and

2059
01:24:06,649 --> 01:24:04,260
the burnout Well Jack is just like hey

2060
01:24:10,550 --> 01:24:06,659
man I got a lot going on lately

2061
01:24:11,930 --> 01:24:10,560
that is how I feel like right now the

2062
01:24:14,750 --> 01:24:11,940
amount of stuff that's gone on with me

2063
01:24:16,250 --> 01:24:14,760
that's mundane it's like I don't I you

2064
01:24:18,590 --> 01:24:16,260
know if I had an oncological shock

2065
01:24:21,169 --> 01:24:18,600
tonight I'd be like it's like coach it's

2066
01:24:24,229 --> 01:24:21,179
like walk it off 15 minutes walk it off

2067
01:24:27,110 --> 01:24:24,239
you know because it's it's like I gotta

2068
01:24:30,530 --> 01:24:27,120
um I take my mom's car to Body Shop I

2069
01:24:32,510 --> 01:24:30,540
got work like yeah it's not really

2070
01:24:37,930 --> 01:24:32,520
um it's not really a framework to

2071
01:24:43,750 --> 01:24:40,370
is inconvenient to The Establishment

2072
01:24:49,550 --> 01:24:43,760
that is the truest [\h__\h] thing

2073
01:24:53,689 --> 01:24:52,250
like disclosure and apocalypse right

2074
01:24:56,149 --> 01:24:53,699
people have this conception that it's

2075
01:24:59,290 --> 01:24:56,159
going to be this single great historical

2076
01:25:03,050 --> 01:24:59,300
event or like oh I'm gonna learn about

2077
01:25:05,630 --> 01:25:03,060
non-human intelligence because this I'm

2078
01:25:07,669 --> 01:25:05,640
gonna see like a giant flying saucer in

2079
01:25:10,130 --> 01:25:07,679
the sky or something

2080
01:25:11,750 --> 01:25:10,140
I think that really what the way that

2081
01:25:15,110 --> 01:25:11,760
people actually

2082
01:25:18,590 --> 01:25:15,120
reshape their minds is not generally in

2083
01:25:21,290 --> 01:25:18,600
big steps and uh it's really in very

2084
01:25:23,330 --> 01:25:21,300
small incremental steps

2085
01:25:25,070 --> 01:25:23,340
um most of the time not all the time of

2086
01:25:28,370 --> 01:25:25,080
course but

2087
01:25:32,090 --> 01:25:28,380
um for me ontological shock

2088
01:25:35,570 --> 01:25:34,310
it

2089
01:25:38,649 --> 01:25:35,580
um

2090
01:25:40,550 --> 01:25:38,659
I don't know where I'm going sorry

2091
01:25:42,050 --> 01:25:40,560
that's okay

2092
01:25:44,090 --> 01:25:42,060
you can finish that thought next week

2093
01:25:45,770 --> 01:25:44,100
right yes yeah you're coming back next

2094
01:25:48,530 --> 01:25:45,780
week

2095
01:25:50,570 --> 01:25:48,540
um or even uh even what I said I was

2096
01:25:52,310 --> 01:25:50,580
joking with Leah on Twitter I'm like

2097
01:25:54,850 --> 01:25:52,320
aliens can duck me tonight as long as

2098
01:25:58,010 --> 01:25:54,860
they wait till Saturday to drop me off

2099
01:26:00,890 --> 01:25:58,020
so I just got

2100
01:26:04,010 --> 01:26:00,900
so I could just kind of um blank on the

2101
01:26:05,750 --> 01:26:04,020
next few days that would be sweet and

2102
01:26:07,129 --> 01:26:05,760
that's kind of what modern I feel like

2103
01:26:09,950 --> 01:26:07,139
that's Modern Life

2104
01:26:11,570 --> 01:26:09,960
yeah no I agree I agree I I think I was

2105
01:26:15,590 --> 01:26:11,580
going off in like a different direction

2106
01:26:18,350 --> 01:26:15,600
kind of and I don't know what happens

2107
01:26:21,290 --> 01:26:18,360
don't worry I'll be much better prepared

2108
01:26:22,729 --> 01:26:21,300
next week right on

2109
01:26:24,470 --> 01:26:22,739
um so we're actually gonna get wrapping

2110
01:26:25,550 --> 01:26:24,480
things up uh here at the bottom of the

2111
01:26:28,189 --> 01:26:25,560
hour

2112
01:26:31,610 --> 01:26:28,199
um I have a very very important date at

2113
01:26:33,709 --> 01:26:31,620
11 so I need to go get my car and get

2114
01:26:35,990 --> 01:26:33,719
going but

2115
01:26:38,270 --> 01:26:36,000
um talesma can't wait to have you on

2116
01:26:40,790 --> 01:26:38,280
next week Jay a friend of the Pod friend

2117
01:26:43,070 --> 01:26:40,800
of the show basically at this point what

2118
01:26:45,229 --> 01:26:43,080
faculty on ins nearly

2119
01:26:46,490 --> 01:26:45,239
um love having both you on and

2120
01:26:48,950 --> 01:26:46,500
contributing

2121
01:26:50,689 --> 01:26:48,960
um really insightful conversation

2122
01:26:51,709 --> 01:26:50,699
um I'm gonna boot both you guys off the

2123
01:26:58,430 --> 01:26:51,719
stream

2124
01:27:02,510 --> 01:27:00,530
thanks both of you for coming on yeah

2125
01:27:04,250 --> 01:27:02,520
this was this was fun I love these

2126
01:27:05,810 --> 01:27:04,260
conversations and I love I honestly love

2127
01:27:08,030 --> 01:27:05,820
and appreciate the crossover into a lot

2128
01:27:10,390 --> 01:27:08,040
of the high strangeness and weird stuff

2129
01:27:16,010 --> 01:27:13,189
too lots of cool stuff in there

2130
01:27:17,930 --> 01:27:16,020
um I want to say before we go that uh I

2131
01:27:21,010 --> 01:27:17,940
just had a lemon and a black licorice at

2132
01:27:24,050 --> 01:27:21,020
the same time super sick

2133
01:27:25,930 --> 01:27:24,060
not not super sick like gnarly and

2134
01:27:28,550 --> 01:27:25,940
awesome

2135
01:27:32,030 --> 01:27:28,560
and uh and now you're gonna go have a

2136
01:27:32,040 --> 01:27:36,350
delicious experience incredible

2137
01:27:40,250 --> 01:27:37,250
um

2138
01:27:42,649 --> 01:27:40,260
so uh

2139
01:27:45,770 --> 01:27:42,659
uh what's going on next week again

2140
01:27:47,629 --> 01:27:45,780
we have talisma on next week cool um

2141
01:27:49,490 --> 01:27:47,639
after that TBD

2142
01:27:51,290 --> 01:27:49,500
um we have Rob from our Strange Skies

2143
01:27:52,729 --> 01:27:51,300
joining us in mid-may super excited

2144
01:27:54,830 --> 01:27:52,739
about that

2145
01:27:56,570 --> 01:27:54,840
um certainly if anyone any audience

2146
01:27:58,370 --> 01:27:56,580
members listeners viewers whatever if

2147
01:27:59,810 --> 01:27:58,380
any of you have suggestions on guests or

2148
01:28:01,129 --> 01:27:59,820
subjects you'd like us to cover please

2149
01:28:03,830 --> 01:28:01,139
feel free to reach out to me on Twitter

2150
01:28:05,570 --> 01:28:03,840
my DMs are open or you can join us on

2151
01:28:07,010 --> 01:28:05,580
Discord there's a link in the show

2152
01:28:09,229 --> 01:28:07,020
description we'd love to have you we

2153
01:28:11,270 --> 01:28:09,239
have a public Discord always welcome

2154
01:28:13,189 --> 01:28:11,280
um new joiners and thoughts

2155
01:28:16,010 --> 01:28:13,199
um before we sign off for the night any

2156
01:28:18,470 --> 01:28:16,020
parting words from you gentlemen

2157
01:28:19,510 --> 01:28:18,480
well it's neat that there was the uh

2158
01:28:22,129 --> 01:28:19,520
first

2159
01:28:24,169 --> 01:28:22,139
Congressional hearing on UFOs in 40

2160
01:28:25,930 --> 01:28:24,179
years that was kind of cool today right

2161
01:28:29,270 --> 01:28:25,940
like

2162
01:28:31,129 --> 01:28:29,280
last year didn't we yeah we have one in

2163
01:28:32,810 --> 01:28:31,139
January it was the first public hearing

2164
01:28:34,790 --> 01:28:32,820
or some crap right like it said

2165
01:28:36,649 --> 01:28:34,800
something there's some distinction in

2166
01:28:38,689 --> 01:28:36,659
the headline that I read that made me

2167
01:28:40,970 --> 01:28:38,699
think it matters okay don't take this

2168
01:28:43,850 --> 01:28:40,980
away from me

2169
01:28:45,709 --> 01:28:43,860
cool remember when we said ins wouldn't

2170
01:28:47,149 --> 01:28:45,719
talk UFOs anymore glad that didn't want

2171
01:28:49,790 --> 01:28:47,159
to ask who said that

2172
01:28:51,050 --> 01:28:49,800
I don't think anyone said that they're

2173
01:28:52,790 --> 01:28:51,060
definitely going to continue talking

2174
01:28:54,770 --> 01:28:52,800
UFOs they're kind of our breaded butter

2175
01:28:58,669 --> 01:28:54,780
but we also have appetites for stuff

2176
01:29:00,890 --> 01:28:58,679
well outside uh the UFO subject I think

2177
01:29:07,010 --> 01:29:00,900
so like assorted jelly beans

2178
01:29:11,450 --> 01:29:09,610
oh yeah

2179
01:29:18,850 --> 01:29:11,460
you should be able to tell us what he's

2180
01:29:23,270 --> 01:29:21,470
what was I thinking you're thinking

2181
01:29:25,250 --> 01:29:23,280
about circles

2182
01:29:27,010 --> 01:29:25,260
I was thinking about a bunch of grapes

2183
01:29:29,689 --> 01:29:27,020
so yes that's correct

2184
01:29:32,090 --> 01:29:29,699
wow it's basically a remote viewer right

2185
01:29:33,850 --> 01:29:32,100
here incredible yeah I don't believe in

2186
01:29:38,149 --> 01:29:33,860
that stuff

2187
01:29:42,229 --> 01:29:40,729
very strange

2188
01:29:43,070 --> 01:29:42,239
a little circle

2189
01:29:45,830 --> 01:29:43,080
um

2190
01:29:47,930 --> 01:29:45,840
all right that's all from that note yes

2191
01:29:50,570 --> 01:29:47,940
we will see you here next Wednesday 9 pm

2192
01:29:55,680 --> 01:29:50,580
Eastern can't wait have a nice night all

2193
01:30:34,210 --> 01:30:31,630
[Music]

2194
01:30:42,550 --> 01:30:34,220
[Applause]

2195
01:30:42,560 --> 01:30:51,920
thank you

2196
01:31:05,370 --> 01:31:03,350
[Music]

2197
01:31:30,890 --> 01:31:05,380
foreign